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In this episode, you will learn about the impact of mycotoxins on health, including antibody testing for mycotoxins.
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About My Guest
My guest for this episode is Dr. Andrew Campbell. Thirty years ago, Andrew Campbell, MD started seeing many women who were sick from their silicone breast implants. Most of them eventually had their implants removed thinking it would solve their health problems, but it didn’t. Dr. Campbell then connected with Dr. Pierre Blais in Canada, a PhD expert in breast implants. His research had shown that many implants had molds in them. He then started treating these patients with an antifungal medication, and they improved tremendously. As his reputation grew, many people started to come see him because of molds growing in their home or workplace due to water damage. Many had gone from doctor to doctor without getting any better. These patients had all kinds of tests done, taken all kinds of pills and supplements, and countless were told “it’s all in your head”. Dr. Campbell has helped well over 10,000 patients with health problems due to molds and mycotoxins. Everyone’s immune system is unique and different, like a fingerprint. That is why there is no one treatment, no one size fits all. The key to the diagnosis and treatment is to see if a person has antibodies to mycotoxins from exposure to molds. These are toxins and have an exceedingly bad and toxic effect on health. He has published his findings with people affected by molds and mycotoxins in medical journals and as chapters in medical books. He has lectured on this subject at medical conferences all over the US, Canada, Mexico, and Europe. In all, he has published over 90 studies; 19 of them on the effects of molds and mycotoxins in people.
- What is the role of mold and mycotoxins in breast implant illness?
- What is the role of mycotoxins in "chronic Lyme disease"?
- Where in the body do mycotoxins have the most health-negating effects?
- What are the symptoms of mycotoxicosis?
- Do mycotoxins impact a fetus during pregnancy? Can they be passed to a child through breastfeeding?
- What is MyMycoLab? What mycotoxin antibodies does it test for?
- How long after an exposure should one wait to perform a MyMycoLab?
- Do the result differentiate between current or past exposure?
- Do mycotoxin antibody levels correlate to the severity of illness?
- How long should one wait before repeating the MyMycoLab after addressing their exposure?
- Can immune suppression or low immunoglobulins lead to false negative MyMycoLab results?
- Is there a connection between IgE mycotoxin antibodies and MCAS?
- How does antibody testing for mycotoxins different from looking for mycotoxins in urine?
- Is removal from the exposure enough, or does fungal colonization in the body need to be considered as part of a treatment strategy?
- How is autoimmunity potentially associated with mycotoxins explored?
- How is mycotoxin-associated illness treated?
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February 24, 2020
Transcript Disclaimer: Transcripts are intended to provide optimized access to information contained in the podcast. They are not a full replacement for the discussion. Timestamps are provided to facilitate finding portions of the conversation. Errors and omissions may be present as the transcript is not created by someone familiar with the topics being discussed. Please Contact Me with any corrections.
[00:00:01] Welcome to BetterHealthGuy Blogcasts, empowering your better health. And now, here's Scott, your Better Health Guy.
[00:00:14] The content of this show is for informational purposes only and is not intended to diagnose, treat or cure any illness or medical condition. Nothing in today's discussion is meant to serve as medical advice or as information to facilitate self-treatment. As always, please discuss any potential health-related decisions with your own personal medical authority.
[00:00:35] Scott: Hello, everyone, and welcome to Episode Number 114 of the BetterHealthGuy Blogcast series. Today's guest is Dr. Andrew Campbell, and the topic of the show is Mycotoxins. Thirty years ago, Andrew Campbell, MD started seeing many women who were sick from their silicone breast implants. Most of them eventually had their implants removed thinking it would solve their health problems, but it didn't. Dr. Campbell then connected with Dr. Pierre Blais in Canada, a PhD expert in breast implants. His research had shown that many implants had molds in them. Dr. Campbell then started treating these patients with antifungal medication, and they improved tremendously. As his reputation grew, many people started to come see him because of molds growing in their home or workplace due to water damage.
Many had gone from doctor to doctor without getting any better. These patients had all kinds of tests done, had taken all kinds of pills and supplements, and countless were told, “It's all in your head.” Dr. Campbell has helped well over 10,000 patients with health problems due to molds and mycotoxins. Everyone's immune system is unique and different, like a fingerprint. That is why there is no one treatment, no one size fits all. The key to the diagnosis and treatment is to see if a person has antibodies to mycotoxins from exposure to molds. These are toxins, so they have an exceedingly bad and toxic effect on health. Dr. Campbell has published his findings with people affected by molds and mycotoxins in medical journals and as chapters in medical books. He has lectured on this subject at medical conferences all over the US, Canada, Mexico, and Europe. In all, he has published over 90 studies; 19 of them on the effects of molds and mycotoxins in people. And now my interview with Dr. Andrew Campbell.
[00:02:35] Scott: Listeners will know that mold illness is something that I personally experienced and find a very critical piece of the puzzle to explore in order to recover from many types of complex chronic illnesses. Today, I'm excited to have Dr. Andrew Campbell here to talk with us about antibody testing for mycotoxins, and how this might be a tool that can help those of us that experience mold and mycotoxin-associated illnesses. Thanks for being here, Dr. Campbell.
[00:03:00] Andrew: Thank you for having me.
[00:03:02] Scott: At a high level, how did you become interested in mold and mycotoxin illnesses? Did you have some type of personal experience that led you to doing the work you do today with complex and chronic illness?
[00:03:15] Andrew: Not a personal issue. I was at my Medical Center in Houston, I saw a number of women who all had the same kind of symptoms no matter what their age, or you know, they were 25, 45, or 65 or shorter, tall or skinny or not, and not skinny, and so on and so forth. And this is prior to computers, this was starting in the late 80s to early 90s. And so I kept going back to my charts at night after work and looking through and there was one commonality, they all had silicone or saline breast implants. And so I started studying what was in the medical literature about that and I found out a bunch of that, yes, they do cause problems. So, I was able to reach out to other doctors and eventually, a lot of these women got explanted. Plastic surgeons were taught how to put them in, but not how to remove them. And so even though they weren't happy with the results, they still had issues with their health. They got maybe marginally better, 20% or so of their health returned, but the other 80% was still missing.
And I'd found a doctor in Canada in Montreal, Canada, Dr. Pierre Blais. Spelled B-L-A-I-S. I grew up and was educated in Switzerland, so French was my first language, not English. And so I called him and we connected well, and I asked him about implants. And to make a long story short, these implants when they come out of the body, they come out and although in the beginning when they're new, they look kind of have an icy blue color. When they're explanted, they're discolored. They have brown, green, dark color, discolorations flecks, floating inside, etc. And when I asked this doctor who has a PhD, who examined all kinds of implantable medical devices, I asked him, “Well, what's that discoloration due?” He said it was due to mold. And I was a little surprised that I said, “Mold? How is it in silicone? Silicone is-- the chemical name is dimethylpolysiloxane. How did it get into that?” He said, “Due to very poor manufacturing methods.” And after I published with other co-authors, many, I don't know, 15-20 studies however many and testified at National Institutes of Health in front of them, they asked me to come up and present my findings. They finally took them off the market for a number of years.
So, I started treating with these ladies with antifungals, antifungal medication. And boy, all of a sudden, the clouds parted, the sun started shining through, and they felt great. And then I got, they're other patients kind of see me and said, “You treated my mom, my sister, my daughter, my neighbor, my aunt, my grandmother, etc, for mold issues due to their silicone. We found mold in our homes or at work or wherever, and we feel terrible. Can you help us?” So, again, I went back to the medical libraries in Houston, there's two medical schools so, you know, there's a lot of stuff to read. And I started reading up on that and start helping patients with that. And then starting in about in the year 2000 or so, 20 years ago, I published a number of studies, I don't know, between 15 and 20, studied on molds and mycotoxins and the problems they cause to the immune system, and how they suppress the immune system and eventually cause all kinds of problems including neurological, cardiac, etc.
[00:07:15] Scott: So, I get a lot of questions about breast implants and I'm curious, are silicone or saline implants safer? Or do they pose equal risk?
[00:07:27] Andrew: What we found in, and remaining scientific because I'm an evidence-based doctor, what we found is it didn't matter because the envelope or the sack, if you wish, it's called an envelope, causes an immune reaction. And when it does, the implants harden. I mean the skin around it gets hard. And due to that, it's due to an immune reaction with the immune system trying to build scar tissue around it to wall it off so it doesn't have to deal with it. But they both turned out bad due to the mold issues they both contain.
[00:08:14] Scott: So, you're talking about capsular contraction, I believe, right. And so is that autoimmune response, is that always the result of mold and mycotoxins? Or can it occur just from the material itself?
[00:08:29] Andrew: In the several thousand women we saw, we did not see a difference between saline or silicone. And since we could not get the data on every single explantation, we had to go with the ones we had which were a few hundred. But still, those all had whether one kind or the other, saline or silicone, they all had mold growing inside the envelope causing-- eventually getting out because they all have a tendency to leak, the envelopes. And after the average age of an implant, even today is 12 years, they tear or they form small holes or whatever and then this stuff gets out.
[00:09:18] Scott: Many of my listeners have been diagnosed with chronic Lyme disease. I had my own journey with Lyme disease, but often find that mold illness plays a very significant role in Lyme, maybe even more important to explore mold in order to regain health from what many people think is simply chronic Lyme disease or solely chronic Lyme disease. So, can you tell us about your observations in terms of treating persistent or chronic Lyme disease patients that aren't getting better?
[00:09:46] Andrew: Sure. And what I can tell you is this significant thing, is last year I published an article, ‘Is it Lyme or is it Mycotoxins?' and it was in the top 10 read articles for 2019 for the year. So, obviously, there's a lot of doctors and people interested in that connection that you just brought up. What we have-- My first experience was this young lady that came to see me from a very important family in the New England area, and she had gone on a camping trip when she was 17. And when she returned, she felt terrible. She had problems going to-- starting her school year, etc, etc. And so somebody in New England diagnosed her with Lyme. She went to the most famous doctor for Lyme on the East Coast in New York. And she treated her for three years starting with oral antibiotics, then going on to intravenous antibiotics, etc, etc. And when she started going to an Ivy League school, she couldn't stay in, she had to drop out within the first semester because of the fatigue, etc. And finally, the mother and father decided to look for different answers and they brought her to me. She was I think 21 at that time. And I did something very simple. I tested her for mycotoxin antibodies, and she lit up like a Christmas tree.
So, I immediately started treating her for mycotoxins. And within three months, she had improved tremendously more than she had ever done before. And her parents, they were thrilled to death and they sent me a lot of their friends who had either, some of them had children who were in their 30s. So, now we're talking about adult children, and others who were adolescence and everything in between, and who had been on Lyme treatment for quite some time without any help. And so, you know, I get all these patients from New England. Then I get them from California, which is, I understand New England as being the forerunner in Lyme cases, but then I started getting them from California and started getting them from Canada, Mexico and all over the place, Europe, Indonesia, and Far East.
[00:12:21] Scott: So, characterize or describe for the listener what mycotoxins are, how large are mycotoxins relative to the mold from which they originate or even maybe to a human hair for example.
[00:12:33] Andrew: Okay, so what are mycotoxins? They're-- Okay, let's go back to molds. There's molds everywhere. There's probably molds in this room. I don't know if there are any in your room, but they're like dead seeds. You know, like the kind of packets you buy at the store because you want to plant some bush or flowering plant, etc, etc. You buy the seed, while they're in this envelope and you can shake it. They're not dead, they're dormant. So, when you put them in soil and wet but add water in a short time you have something growing out of it. Well, molds are like that. They're spores everywhere, you get them wet and you let them stay wet for 24 to 48 hours, they start to make spores, what is called in medicine “sporulate”. And these spores just spread into the air in huge amounts; when you walk through the room, when a window is open and shut that kind of tremor when air circulates etc, it spreads them throughout. The government says that in a 1,500 square foot home, within six weeks from one focus the entire home is contaminated. So, these are tiny, and they carry with them a mycotoxin. And not a mycotoxin; one spore, one kind of mold will produce a series of different mycotoxins, and these go everywhere. So, human hair is 100 microns.
A spore is average 10 microns and mycotoxins is 0.1 micron, which means it goes through anything. It goes through your skin, it gets on everything and it causes problems. The first doctor that noticed that was Dr. Fleming in Scotland back in the 1930s. He was going on holiday, the British go on holiday, not vacations. He had two petri dishes, and he forgot to cover them. In one petri dish, he had Staphylococcus aureus and the other one that a mold called Penicillium. When he came back from his holiday, the Staphylococcus, which is a bad bacteria, was dead and the Penicillium was fine. So, after years of investigation, he figured out that there's a mycotoxin Produced by Penicillium that kills bacteria, and he developed the first antibiotic penicillin. So, we know for, since today, if you go in and have-- if a patient goes in for a transplant, they're going to give you a medication called Cyclosporine, which suppresses your immune system, so that you don't reject the new implant, new organ. And this is what mycotoxins do, they're tiny, they get into the deepest part of your lungs when you're breathing, etc. And so within a few days of being wet, your breathing, mycotoxins are getting on your skin, you're absorbing them, you're swallowing them because they get on your sandwich, your cup of tea or whatever you're drinking.
[00:15:55] Scott: Are there specific places in the body where mycotoxins have the most health negating effects or specific targets that they impact the most within us?
[00:16:05] Andrew: The most common effects are the immune system and the nervous system. Immune system, which is suppressed because they're very potent protein synthesis inhibitors, they change DNA and RNA, they shut down the mitochondria in cells, etc. That's one side. The other side is they really affect nerves; both the brain and peripheral nerves.
[00:16:35] Scott: What types of symptoms would you think would lead you to considering mycotoxins in a particular condition? And then more broadly, what illnesses or conditions do you think are associated with mycotoxin burdens?
[00:16:49] Andrew: The most common symptom is fatigue. And that's the most common symptom in a lot of diseases and disorders including Lyme. So, fatigue is one and then you know, you get this mental fog, you get short term memory loss, anxiety, depression, mood swings. Everybody has good days and bad days, but these are like this many during the same day. You have problems with numbness and tingling, fine tremor issues of that nature. Also, you get a lot of issues with aches and pains in your body and joints and muscles, incoordination, etc. And it's very simple, you test for antibodies find out, do I have this, or I don't?
[00:17:41] Scott: Are there certain conditions that you think someone should explore mycotoxins as a potential contributor? What are the conditions where that should be high on the list of things to check off or explore?
[00:17:54] Andrew: Well, one thing is you mentioned Lyme. Okay, so if you have Lyme, you should also check for mycotoxins. But it's what-- And I'm going to give this in a reverse way because mycotoxins produce adducts, antibodies of mycotoxins produced adducts, and adducts bind to human tissue. When they bind to human tissue, this triggers autoimmunity. So, what am I talking about? I'm talking about MS, I'm talking about rheumatoid arthritis, lupus, Sjogren’s Syndrome, on and on and on and on. So, I've seen a number of patients with Crohn's disease etc, who've come to me with those autoimmune disorders. I test them and I test them for mycotoxins, and lo and behold, they're positive. If they're in the early stages, I can get rid of the cause of this autoimmunity, which were the mycotoxins. And by getting rid of the cause, you get rid of the disorder instead of treating the disorder.
[00:19:01] Scott: Would you put Chronic Fatigue Syndrome, Fibromyalgia, autism or Alzheimer's disease; would you put those high on the list of conditions where mycotoxins should also be explored?
[00:19:15] Andrew: Absolutely. And several studies have shown that mycotoxin in autopsies of brain of people who've died of-- with and who had Alzheimer, up to 28% had mycotoxins in the brain. So, it's a significant amount, medically speaking. The other part is in autism, I remember this one case where this medical doctor from a surgical specialty in a city and his wife brought me, there's flu I don't know how over how many doctors and brought me there a little boy and said, “I've gone all specialists they all tell me he's autistic. Is there anything you can do” And I said well, why would you come to see me after you've been to see all these doctors?” She says, “Because we were in our office, and on a Saturday working both, he and his wife and they had their little boy in a playpen, this is when he was younger, and these guys showed up in a Tyvek suit with respirators and everything else and say, “We're here to check your office for mold.” And he looks at them and says, “There's no mold here.” He says, “You don't understand two floors above you against this wall was a sink and that sink has been leaking all this time, and it's behind this wall. And that's the wall where they kept on Saturdays, putting the playpen with their little boy.” So, I said to Dad, “I'm going to do these tests. But if you want since you're a trained doctor, let's start your son on antifungals and see what happens.” And within three weeks mom calls me sobbing because her son spoke to her and looked her in the eye and asked for something to eat. She was overwhelmed emotionally. And I've had this happen again and again. Within a year, he was in a regular school. Is he still having issues? Yes. But to go to a normal school, to be able to learn, to be able to live a life and to have this erase; to any parent, that is huge.
[00:21:29] Scott: Absolutely.
[00:21:30] Andrew: Both in Alzheimer's and autism and I've done this with Alzheimer's patients. I've had patients come to me with a stack of medical records, high MRIs and everything else. I have Alzheimer's. And I test them for mycotoxins, they show up with my-- I treat them for mycotoxins, six months later, the Alzheimer's is gone.
[00:21:52] Scott: Some people in the mold illness community would suggest that mycotoxins are only a very small part of the problem that results from water damage building. So, what are your thoughts on the significance of mycotoxicosis in chronic illnesses?
[00:22:07] Andrew: Well, first of all, again, I'm evidence-based so I go according to the medical literature, which does not support the other theory that they're a minor issue. Every study coming out from countries all over the world from China and the Far East, Japan, to Europe, to North America, and I mean, Canada and the United States all say the same things. Molds are the gun, mycotoxins are the bullet. So, if someone is minimizing, I would ask them, show me, the literature, the written, published literature to support what you're saying. Because that's not what scientists and doctors all over the world are saying.
[00:22:52] Scott: Talk to us a little bit about the impact of mycotoxins on a fetus during a pregnancy and then can mycotoxins be passed to a child through breastfeeding?
[00:23:05] Andrew: Yes, what I've seen and I've had patients referred to me by OB-GYNs, a mother will have-- will be six months pregnant with twins and one twin will die. Things like that, horrible. Just terrible things. So, mycotoxins being so small, what the literature has shown is yes, they can go through the placenta into the fetus and also into breast milk after the baby's born. So, both are possible.
[00:23:43] Scott: Let's talk a little bit about the testing that you offer. You're the medical director for MyMycoLab. So, give us an overview of the testing at MyMycoLab. What makes it unique?
[00:23:53] Andrew: What's unique, it's the only blood test available for this problem. And we have blood tests coming in from Australia, all over Europe, all over North America, Mexico, etc, etc. So, the test is to antibodies because you don't want to know if they exist in blood, that's not available yet technologically but antibodies are. There was a laboratory that used to offer this during-- for 10 years, but then they quit doing that test. And as a result, people started testing urine. Urine tests the, not the mycotoxin; it tests the metabolites of mycotoxins, so it's not an accurate test. Secondly, we get mycotoxins in our body from food. I love peanut butter. I have to confess, you know, and I've always loved it; peanuts, nuts, beans, including coffee beans. All 25% according to the World Health Organization, United States Department of Agriculture etc, about 25% of all crops contain, may contain mycotoxins. They even regulated in the United States the percent of mycotoxins in foods that you can sell. So, its tiniest, parts per billion. I asked the scientist once, “What is parts per billion? I can't picture that. I need a mental picture.” He says ,“Take 10 football fields, cover these 10 football fields with one layer of white golf balls and put into there one yellow golf ball. That yellow golf ball is one part per billion.” I said “Well, I can imagine that. Okay, that helps me picture this.”
So, that's what you're excreting from what you ate and drank that day. If you've ever had a beer you may have had some mycotoxin exposure, and that's in the medical literature as well. So, if you're peeing it out, that's a good thing. You're getting rid of what your body wants to get rid up. But it doesn't mean pathology, it just means excretion that day at that time. Antibodies are completely different because they not only tell you that you have them, but they give the body burden. And then as I mentioned before, these antibodies can form adducts and bind to human tissue, triggering autoimmunity. So, for example, in patients who have high levels of several mycotoxins, I will always recommend doing an autoimmune profile or panel in them because guess what they may have developed autoimmunity. And by quickly attacking the mycotoxins in the body and getting rid of them, guess what? That autoimmunity now no longer is being stimulated and slowly, slowly, slowly, slowly fades away. And I've seen it in thousands, I've treated almost 14,000 patients. So, I know I've seen it happen many, many times.
[00:27:19] Scott: So, let's talk a little bit more about antibody testing. So, if someone does antibody testing to the molds themselves, and the interpretation is often that well, that may represent allergy. It may not necessarily be an indication that you have an illness resulting from that mold exposure. So, why is it different when we look at antibodies to mycotoxins? How do we know that those antibodies being present correlate to illness?
[00:27:47] Andrew: So, there's no real use in doing IgM antibodies because those antibodies from the time of exposure last three weeks, about 20 days, and then they fade away because then IgG antibodies come along. And those IgG is your army. M is like the Marines. They're the first guys who get there, they fight. Then the army comes in with the latrines, the cooking, the canteen, etc, etc and all the big guns, so they're the big ones. IgE shows an immediate response. In other words, if I were to walk into some place that is moldy and has mycotoxins and I start feeling ill within a day or two, I'm going to have IgE antibodies to that, and I think it's going to go away. It's maybe just the flu, something I ate, you know, I needed to rest. I haven't taken my vitamins like I should blah, blah, blah. And after a month or two, it's still with you. This is when you do antibodies. And what the lab does is both IgG and IgE antibodies. So, I get asked this question a lot. “Oh, well, the patient left the home where there were mycotoxins a month ago. Will they still have antibodies?” Well, you bet. Of course they will. Your body makes these antibodies. It doesn't go away because you happen to have left. You look for antibodies in Lyme people. There were bitten back six months ago. You still are having Lyme antibodies. A year later, year and a half, two years later, you have these antibodies because you haven't gotten rid of the issue. So, in mycotoxins, you have IgG, which is the long-term toxic reaction by the immune system, and you have the IgE, which is more the mastocytes being stimulated and causing inflammation for you.
[00:30:04] Scott: So, you test 12 different mycotoxins looking at IgG, IgE. What are the mycotoxins that are tested for with MyMycoLab, and are there other health impacting mycotoxins that are not yet part of the testing panel?
[00:30:19] Andrew: Okay. So, we test for several-- well, 12 types one is Satrotoxin. Then-- these are two but I consider them one, so you're actually getting more than 12 is Verrucarin and Verrucarol. And then we do two Ochratoxins; Ochratoxin A, and Ochratoxin B. And I have to mention here that studies have shown that ochratoxins bind very strongly to albumin in the human body. Albumin is the number one protein in your body. And Ochratoxin binds to albumin at 99.8% affinity. It is-- as it goes through the kidney, it's reabsorbed by all parts, both by active and diffuse method. So, it cannot be excreted in urine, but urine labs constantly report them as high. So, in the medical literature they say that is not possible. So, we test for both Ochratoxin A and B in the blood. We also do T2 toxins now, the famous T2 toxin. Why is it famous? Because it's been weaponized. We used it in Cambodia, the Chinese used it in Cambodia back-- way back when. Saddam Hussein used it in his war when he was fighting against the Iranians. And so it's been weaponized.
We think that all countries probably have weapons with this biotoxin. Vomitoxin, also known as D-O-N, and this one causes real significant hormonal changes. Mycotoxins have the ability to affect your hormones, but this one in particular. We do Cladosporium toxin, we do Alternaria toxin, which is called Alternariol, but most people know the word Alternaria. We do Aspergillus toxin, it's hemolysin and then we do Aspergillus Auto-Toxin which is Sterigmatocystin. And we also do Penicillium toxin which is Mycophenolic acid. We do Aspergillus/Penicillium Neuro Auto-Toxin which causes a lot of the neurological issues. And lastly, we do Stachybotrys toxin, which is from the famous black mold, but it's really called Trichothecene. People don't know what Trichothecene means; they do know black mold, etc, Stachybotrys.
[00:33:35] Scott: So, how long would it take after an exposure to mold or mycotoxins to see a positive antibody response on MyMycoLab? You mentioned IgE happens relatively quickly. But since you're looking at IgG and IgE, is there a certain period of time after an exposure that we need to wait in order to get the clearest, most accurate picture from the test?
[00:33:59] Andrew: Standard is a month. However, most patients when they get exposed don't realize they've been exposed. And they get treated for Chronic Fatigue Syndrome, Fibromyalgia, they get treated for their-- Oh, you mean you can't sleep. Here's a pill for sleep. Oh, you have aches and pains, here, take an anti-inflammatory. Oh, you have headaches, here's a pill for your headaches, etc, etc, etc. And then after months go by and they still aren't better, then they come eventually, eventually. The only time I've actually seen a patient come to me within three months was a young woman who sold software to dentists throughout Louisiana. And she stayed in these little small towns where there might be one or two dentists only. And the air conditioning in the motels was a unit that was high end of the window. And underneath she could see mold growing in the walls. And when she got sick, she was smart enough to come right away to our center where we treated.
[00:35:04] Scott: Is it possible to discern from the MyMycoLab results whether an exposure is current or past exposure? And one of the criticisms that I heard about antibody testing for mycotoxins is that it may show that there was an immune response in the past, but may not reflect a current issue.
[00:35:22] Andrew: No, that's a misconception because once you are no longer affected, etc, after six months or more, it goes away. But it does take six months. You got treated, you no longer have mycotoxins, it's going to go because there's no more immune stimulation. As long as they're immune stimulation, it's going to stay at that level. You've gotta have the immune system trying to protect you from these mycotoxins. So, as long as they're doing that you're going to have levels. It's not “Oh, well, you know, four years ago I was in, I don't know where and I was exposed. And so I'm going to have these.” No, you're not going to have any if you are exposed in a specific space, and then you're fine now and nothing's happened the last few years.
[00:36:21] Scott: Does the mycotoxin antibody level correlate to the severity of the illness? Meaning, if we had higher antibodies, does that always correlate to a sicker patient? Or can we have elevated antibodies, but those antibodies potentially representing a healthy response of the immune system in terms of responding to and eliminating mycotoxins?
[00:36:44] Andrew: I have never had a patient come to me and say I'm well, but I wanted to get checked for mycotoxins. I have no symptoms, I'm healthy as a horse, blah, blah. I've always seen patients who came because they were ill. So, I'll have-- that's one thing. Secondly, if you have an ongoing stimulation and fight with the immune system, you're going to have an elevation and severe elevation, the more the stimulation is there to the immune system, and your immune system trying to fight it back and keep it from harming you. So, if it's still high, you're going to have symptoms. You're not going to be well, you're going to be a sick puppy, so to speak. But, you know, you're not going to be-- You're not going to feel I feel great, but I've got high levels of these two or four or whatever, mycotoxins. No, you're gonna feel them. You're gonna have--
[00:37:50] Scott: So, would we say then that there's a correlation between higher antibody responses on the test and the body burden of mycotoxins remaining?
[00:38:00] Andrew: Yes, it correlates with that. So, you may not feel better for several months, but it takes a long time. If your checkbook is in the red by $1,000, it's going to take a lot of money that-- it's going to take that thousand dollars for it to just be even for you to be at zero. And then for you to feel really better, you've got to put several hundred dollars more into your checking account. So, you're bringing this patient from way below, down here to level and then making them better. And that takes time. So, when they start feeling, they will be the first to tell you, “You know, I'm starting to feel better.” That doesn't mean you stop. You continue till they say to you, “I feel well. I'm back to my old self again. I can do all the things-- Doctor, I love you. You're wonderful. You helped me.”
[00:38:57] Scott: Let's say that someone is in a water damaged building, has mycotoxin antibodies, they remediate, they move, they then want to later retest. A listener asked, how long should they wait before retesting with MyMycoLab in order to see that they actually have moved in a good direction and the antibodies have started to reduce. You mentioned six months, so I'm assuming it's about six months.
[00:39:20] Andrew: After you begin treatment. The first rule of toxicology is get the patient away from the toxin and the toxin away from the patient. So, they got to move out. No, treatment will help if they're still being exposed on a regular basis. But after they start treatment, six months.
[00:39:38] Scott: Let's talk a little bit about immunoglobulin-based testing, some looking at IgE, IgG or subclasses of IgG, look at those to see that some people may have low immunoglobulins. And so I'm wanting to hear your thoughts about the potential for the MyMycoLab to maybe not show a response to mycotoxins when there may actually be a mycotoxin issue if the person has suppressed immunity or even potentially is on some type of immunosuppressive medication.
[00:40:10] Andrew: Well, first of all, you can't test anybody if they're on immunosuppressive medication. They've got to get off the corticosteroids or whatever medication they're on for six weeks and then get tested. Now, these are two common misconceptions. One is, well, if this suppresses your immune system, how are you going to get an immune response? The second is, what happens if the patient is low in a particular globulin, say low and an IgG subclass or whichever. Those are misconceptions. If you are low and immune-suppressed to that point, you'd be a-- Remember the bubble boy? Okay. Well, then you'd be in a bubble because you wouldn't live without an immune system or with an immune system so severely suppressed, you would not be able to tolerate. One thing, for example, that's been shown now for quite many-- quite a number of years is that Candida, simple Candida will kill a person with a suppressed immune system such as someone with advanced HIV. You and I don't have to worry about Candida because our immune system will take care of it even if it's suppressed, even if you have low immunoglobulin levels. But when the immune system, not your immune immunoglobulin levels, when your immune system is so suppressed because of a very, very nasty virus, that's what will-- Fortunately, we've advanced past those terrible stages and now we don't have to worry about that. Now, we have medication. But I remember back in days with people with HIV would die of a simple complication from Candida, yeast.
[00:42:14] Scott: So, the immune suppression that occurs potentially from mycotoxins or mold illness or from Lyme disease is not enough to lead to the MyMycoLab potentially having a false negative result is what I'm hearing?
[00:42:28] Andrew: That's correct. Well, just taking it to the immune system rather to a lab, your immune system is still going to function because you're out in public. You're being exposed to lots of things every day, but we make it.
[00:42:45] Scott: So, the people reaching out to MyMycoLab obviously suspected that they have a mold or mycotoxin associated condition. But approximately what percentage of tests that you do confirm or show a positive result in turn antibody production to mycotoxins?
[00:43:05] Andrew: I would say for-- Well, for one, it's going to depend on the clinician's ability to really do detect, we do get some samples that are completely normal. There's no mycotoxin antibody-- no immune response to any mycotoxin. But I think that was mainly due to perhaps the clinician not asking the right questions or not finding out more about living conditions, working conditions, etc. But we always have a percent of people that show up and they're basically normal.
[00:43:45] Scott: Mast Cell Activation Syndrome is a common issue for many different types of chronic illnesses. Does an IgE response on your test suggest an activation of the mast cells? And if so, is that activation the result of the mold exposure or the mycotoxin exposure or both?
[00:44:04] Andrew: Well, IgE antibodies to mycotoxins will stimulate mast cells to release their inflammatory chemicals into the circulation. I'll give you an example. A young man 32 years old, came to see me last August with problems relating to his legs. They would cramp up terribly. He'd have electrical shooting pains down his legs, etc. I asked him about-- he's engineer, electrical engineer. I asked him about his working conditions, and they were terrible because he worked at a plant, a factory. So, we did the mycotoxins and sure enough, he lit up, started treating him and then after six months, they went away. He calls me out of the blue and says, “I'm feeling the same stuff again.” This is right at-- recently. And he came into the office. I mean, he could barely walk with one leg. It was so bad. He had to stay off work, etc. I re-tested him, his IgE were elevated way high. His IgG were normal. He'd been treated. So, I asked him, “Where did you go? Did you go anywhere during the Christmas holidays?” He says, “Well, yeah. Actually, for my family, we all went to this place in Marco Island, Florida for three weeks.” I said, “Was it moldy?” “Yeah, it was, smelled a little funny.” Well, guess what? He got re-exposed but the re-exposure showed the IgG…that's the symptoms. That's the immediate symptoms. So, I don't know if that answers your question. But basically, those are typical of what we see-- what I see in my practice, but also what clinicians will see.
[00:46:10] Scott: Some practitioners use HLA DR testing as a tool to assess the genetic predisposition to mold and mycotoxin illness or mycotoxin clearance. What are your thoughts on HLA testing for biotoxin illness or mold illness?
[00:46:25] Andrew: Okay. So, again, I'm evidence-based, and I would like to see evidence in the medical literature that as its stated, 25% of the US population, which means 85 to 90 million people have this genetic defect. If that were true, every lab in the United States would be touting this test. Because you have the potential for almost 100 million clients out there to do this test. Nowhere in the medical literature is it written that this is found in 25% of patients, nowhere, it does not exist. And I did invite any doctor, go to PubMed, it's free. It's the National Library of Medicine. Look up--
[00:47:18] Scott: You've shared some of your thoughts on urine mycotoxin testing. And so I'm curious if someone has a highly positive urine mycotoxin test but a negative MyMycoLab immune antibody result; would you then conclude that mold and mycotoxins are likely not the cause of their health challenge?
[00:47:39] Andrew: Well, I've never had that situation happened to me where a patient said, you know, their mycotoxin antibody tests is normal. Then they bring me a urine test which is positive, then I would say to them, “How do you feel?” “Well, I feel normal.” “Oh, well, that's good because now you're showing that your body is exceeding what it needs to excrete, and urine is an excretion. The only time it's a problem is if you're creating proteins or sugar.
[00:48:10] Scott: So, if we then take it a step further and say that mycotoxins in urine are potentially healthy, a good sign, we're detoxifying desirable; couldn't immune response to mycotoxins also be potentially healthy and desired or at least not pathogenic? So, for example, you mentioned you like peanut butter. If that peanut butter has an exposure to aflatoxin, would you then have a positive MyMycoLab test or not?
[00:48:39] Andrew: No, because I'm not-- I feel great. I don't have a disease process that's going on. As a matter of fact, I just had my physical this morning…sorry, but it's true. And, you know, I feel great. Yeah. I played golf with my grandson yesterday, 18 holes without any problems, and I'm 71. So, if I tested positive for antibodies, then the antibody test, I would say was not useful. But the medical literature says it's the most accurate test, it's the most specific test, and it's the most indicative test for body burden. So, I have to go by what the literature says.
[00:49:31] Scott: Can I then conclude that ongoing exposure to mycotoxins from food sources, we do not believe that would result in a positive MyMycoLab test. Is that correct?
[00:49:42] Andrew: That's correct. It will not.
[00:49:44] Scott: Okay. Thank you.
[00:49:45] Andrew: ...antibody's gonna grab it, the immune system is going to grab it, build an antibody, get rid of it, it's gone. It's no longer stimulating the immune system and the immune system is fine. It's strong, it's doing its thing.
[00:49:58] Scott: Do you think that these environmental exposures lead to colonization within the body such that if we're in a water damage building, we get to a completely safe, clean mold pure environment; could we still be producing mycotoxins in the body that could then continue to lead to mycotoxin antibodies?
[00:50:21] Andrew: Yes.
[00:50:22] Scott: So, just removing from the source of the exposure is not enough. That's where you were referring to the use of antifungals as well because we can still have this ongoing production of mycotoxins leading to illness.
[00:50:35] Andrew: Correct. So, we're at a place where there was a lot of radiation, and now you move to a different state where they don't even have radiation. Does that mean the radiation illness will go away? No.
[00:50:50] Scott: Yeah, and I think that's important because that is something that I've heard practitioners on both sides of that discussion. To me, it seems very logical that we could have this colonization. But for those people that move to another environment and don't get better, you may want to have conversation with your practitioner about the potential for colonization within the body itself that might require some antifungal treatment.
[00:51:14] Andrew: You're absolutely correct.
[00:51:16] Scott: In those people with the potential for autoimmunity that you mentioned that can be triggered from mycotoxin exposure, is there a specific test that you recommend and do the results of that test change your treatment protocols?
[00:51:30] Andrew: I recommend, of-- Okay. So, when patients come to see me, they've usually seen a number of doctors. I just saw a 28-year-old who had seen 28 doctors. I can remember the number easily because they were both 28. So, here's this 28-year-old who had to go to 28 doctors and he still felt awful. He tried-- He was given trials of medications, trials of supplements, detoxification, liver detox, all kinds of things. Nothing helped. He tested positive and it was elevated in several mycotoxins. Six weeks later, he's feeling much better. I did not expect him in six weeks to feel much better, honestly speaking, but I think he was so desperate to find-- He was depressed, you know. When you're sick, and you're that young and you still feel sick and you've just been to 28 doctors, that's going to affect you. I don't mean you're depressed because woe is me, but you're depressed because you're worried, you wake up worried every day, you go to bed worried every night, and that anxiety will bring on that depression.
So, I think he feels better because he's no longer anxious or depressed. He's found the reason and the cause. So, clinicians have to be aware of the mental aspects of their patients who have these chronic illnesses. So, I don't see patients who come in and who are feeling terrible, and I'm the first doctor they see they always bring me a bunch of tests. So, they've already been tested for A to Z, from this to that, they've had the usual CBCs, chemistry profiles. They've had all kinds of other tests, so I don't need to really do that much testing. And so besides the common tests that are done by most folks, most clinicians, you know, the Common Test, if you-- all that is normal, and you're not having other issues, co-morbidities as we call them in medicine, then, you know, I would always recommend that you do CBC with differential, you do a chemistry 26 panel, thyroid hormone; things of that nature depending on the age and sex of your patient, and find out what those levels are. And if those are all pretty good and pretty normal, then think about mycotoxins.
[00:54:12] Scott: In terms of the testing that you prefer then for autoimmunity, is there a specific profile or panel or lab that you like to look at?
[00:54:23] Andrew: Yes. I used to use Immunosciences Laboratories, but they have kind of, you know, reduced the number of testing they do. And really, the lab that's kind of taken over that is called Cyrex. And so there's a panel, very thorough, very complete panel of autoimmune-- for autoimmunity, and it's there-- They call them arrays at Cyrex. Its array number five.
[00:54:53] Scott: Let's say that we have someone where the MyMycoLab is positive for mycotoxin antibodies, the Cyrex panel confirms autoimmunity treatment is implemented. They retest, the MyMycoLab is now negative. Would you speculate that that would generally then correlate with resolution of the autoimmunity?
[00:55:15] Andrew: It may and it may not because part of the treatment and dealing with mycotoxins is not only antifungal but the other part and it’s a balance is to bring up the immune system, is to improve the immune system, you know, reduce environmental factors. If you live at a crossroads of two highways, my goodness, I hope you move away from all that, you know, all those chemicals being emitted by cars and trucks. If you're, you know, downwind from a large factory if your husband or wife works at a factory or a plant where they make sense certain chemicals, my gosh. So, reduce your environmental factors. Make sure your diet is clean. You know, no more Cokes or Fantas, please, you know. Let's drink lots of water and don't buy it in bottled water, I just read a study-- Thank you. I just read a study that now they're saying BPA free because they've put in BPS. Well, that doesn't change it. It's still bisphenol and it's a hormone disruptor. So, you know, you've got to look at-- help your patient understand all these factors. I mean, my favorite olive oil now comes in plastic. Okay.
So, go through all that, make sure they eat healthy and balanced. The best diet, of course, is the Mediterranean diet, but not many people like it and not many people can afford it. So, to try to reduce what they do like, I mean, what happens when you get a Texan that's six foot six, wearing jeans and a belt buckle the size of a hubcap, and you tell him, you know, you can eat steak for breakfast, lunch, and dinner. You know, he's got to say some choice words about you. So, you've got to think of your patient and help your patient, hold their hand through all these changes, and modify how they eat and what they're drinking. Explain it. Don't say don't use bottled water. Explain to them why and then they'll understand. So, do all that and use the right supplements for your patients. Get the best, not the cheapest supplements. Get the best. Don't get the ones that come, you know, the powder comes from China and then it's put into capsules in the United States. Buy good quality supplements and give them to your patients, things like that.
[0:58:06] Scott: Let's talk a little bit about the diet piece. So, we've heard you say that exposure to mycotoxins in foods in certain people may not pose any problem at all. In those people who have a chronic illness, however, would you generally recommend a diet that is low in those foods that might lead to mold or mycotoxin exposure?
[00:58:29] Andrew: I have a diet. I wouldn't call it a diet, a nutritional guideline that I give my patients. Okay. And so, in that nutritional, in those nutritional guidelines are, here's what you can eat all you want, and here's what you should limit, and this is what you should never have. You know, and I'm sorry, no more donuts. No more, you know, all those kind of things. But for instance, beans such as coffee beans are known to have parts per billion, that one yellow golf ball. Well, your body can handle that tiny amount. It doesn't-- Your immune system kicks that right off, even if it's suppressed because of other problems. Because if your immune system quit working or was so suppressed, you'd catch every flu bug around just by being millions of miles away from the center of coronavirus, you'd have it.
[00:59:42] Scott: Many of these complex illnesses have a mitochondrial component. So, I'm curious how significantly do mycotoxins impact our mitochondria, our ability to produce energy or ATP? And do you find that mitochondrial support is often needed in addition to removal from the source and antifungal treatment in order to get people back on track?
[01:00:06] Andrew: That's an excellent question. And yes, it affects the mitochondria. And that mitochondria stops making ATP and then you have cell apoptosis, which is cell death. And remember, it also affects your DNA and RNA. And what happens when you mess with DNA? Cancer. So, it affects all those things.
[01:00:0316] Scott: In looking at the impact of the environment and the need to reduce exposure, how much exposure does it take to create ongoing immune activation?
[01:00:43] Andrew: Every immune system, every person's immune system is unique and different, like a fingerprint. Even in monozygotic twins, meaning twins from the same egg meaning, etc. Okay. And they've done studies in twins for autoimmunity. Where one twin will be will have an autoimmune disease and the other not. So, the point being is that there is no one size fits all. There is no way to say this is how much unique. You put 10 people in a room, same age, same height, same weight, expose them to the same thing, you may get different responses in each one; different degrees of responses. So, that's why, there's some methods out there of treatment, which are protocols. Protocols don't work with this. I mean, I've had families come to see me where mom, dad, and three kids all living in a moldy house and mycotoxins galore and they're being, affecting them. And wow, five different treatments.
[01:02:00] Scott: What are some of the tools that you find lead to the best clearance of mycotoxins from the body? Do you use Cholestyramine or other tools?
[01:02:10] Andrew: I would tell people to stay away from Cholestyramine specifically, as Cholestyramine binds everything, binds good and bad. I originally trained in surgery, and I remember when Cholestyramine, we used to give that to patients when we take out their gallbladder and now they had bile coming out of the liver right directly into the intestines causing diarrhea. So, we would give them Cholestyramine to bind it, but Cholestyramine binds a lot of different medications, including any and all hormones. What happens if a patient is taking thyroid hormone or progesterone or estrogen or testosterone? Can't get-- but they're prescribed Cholestyramine. So, no. You can't give it in certain health conditions, etc. So, don't use Cholestyramine. What you do want to use is something that's been used for years and years, and it's cheap, and it's effective, activated charcoal. And you want to make sure you give it away from the times that you take either medications or supplements or whatever. Or foods because it's going to bind the good stuff that's in your food; the minerals, the vitamins, the nutrients in your food it's going to bind them and then you're going to poop them out.
[01:03:44] Scott: Are there other detoxification tools that you use as adjuncts to activated charcoal to assist the body in getting rid of mycotoxins?
[01:03:54] Andrew: Yes, I mean, I use fish oil, use a very good quality fish oil, curcumin to help the inflammation, resveratrol and there is one brand that puts fish oil, CoQ10, curcumin, and resveratrol into the same capsule. So, I love that, I take it personally because it's very healthy. I make sure that the patient takes zinc. Zinc is the number one mineral, most needed by the immune system. So, you've got to take the zinc. I also recommend Vitamin D3 5,000 international units daily. I also give-- recommend that my patients take NAC N-acetyl-cysteine because that's very helpful as a precursor to glutathione, etc, etc. So, it's good to have on board. I also think that taking melatonin at bedtime, not for sleep but just to have that because it's a good neuroprotector. Now many patients were affected by molds and mycotoxins will also have demyelination. And many of them have come to see me, they've been diagnosed with MS, a demyelinating condition. Lo and behold after treatment, their MS is gone. And you know what happens? Their neurologist called me and they're angry at me. Go figure. I mean, I just helped them with their patient and they're not happy. I guess they wanted to keep seeing that patient over and over and generating office visits and whatnot. But regardless, so for those patients, you've got to do a very thorough workup and give them intravenous gamma globulin to reverse the demyelination.
[01:05:50] Scott: Do you support the use of far infrared sauna for mycotoxin clearance?
[01:05:55] Andrew: Yes. I don't recommend Turkish steam bath or the Swedish, Finnish types of hot rocks or Russian also. I do recommend the infrared, absolutely.
[01:06:10] Scott: And just because I'm sure we're going to get some questions afterwards, the supplement that you mentioned a moment ago, if people want to find that my understanding is that that's available through Dr. Stephen Sinatra. Is that correct?
[01:06:23] Andrew: Yes it is. And I have to disclose that I'm a friend of his.
[01:06:27] Scott: Shame on you.
[01:06:30] Andrew: I take it personally and it cost me also. I mean, he's not gonna give it to me free. I don't even ask for it free, but the point is, is that it's very good. That's the important thing. My wife takes it, my mother takes it. My mother's 102 and she still--
[01:06:44] Scott: Wow. As I understand mycotoxins can be stored deeply in our fat, they can be intracellular. How do we get the body to release mycotoxins from deeper storage locations, and from inside the cells?
[01:06:59] Andrew: Remember part of any treatment, including what you mentioned, in the beginning, autism and Alzheimer, etc, etc, part of that is exercise. And it doesn't mean you have to join a gym. No, it means walking, doing something you enjoy doing. Walk the dog or cat or if you don't like that then just walk, take a nice walk, and don't stroll. Walk like you have an appointment. That's what Dr. Dan Amen taught me years ago. He says, “Tell your patients to walk like they're going to an appointment, they're just a little bit late.” He has a great sense of humor. Anyway, so that exercise and the change in diet is going to make you start losing weight, which means you're going to start losing fat cells. And what'll happen is and patients they'll suddenly start feeling bad again because here's these fat cells dissolving releasing these mycotoxins. And I have to mention here too, that you may want to tell your patients that they may undergo Herxheimer reaction.
[01:08:07] Scott: In those with Mast Cell Activation Syndrome that may be triggered by mold and mycotoxins; do you find that adding specific interventions that stabilize the mast cells and reduce histamine intolerance while they're working through detoxification of those mycotoxins? Do you find that that helps people better tolerate treatment and reduces their symptoms?
[01:08:29] Andrew: I've had patients undergo but the results have been marginal at best. I think they should just stay on, on the treatment that their clinician who knows them and who knows all their different conditions. Stick with that, and eventually, you'll overcome them.
[01:08:50] Scott: Coming back to the conversation around colonization, antifungal therapy; what have you found helpful? How do you address the sinuses, the gut? Do you use systemic antifungal agents? What are your thoughts on colonization treatment?
[01:09:05] Andrew: Colonization treatment is still-- I use, I've used and still use Itraconazole 100 milligrams twice a day with food. And don't give it for a month or two, give it for at least six months. And for those clinicians who are worried about liver function studies, etc, when I first started, I checked liver function every two weeks. And then when I found no one, not a single one had made any-- no reaction whatsoever. I started doing them every month, while on Itraconazole or Sporanox, and then nothing happens. So, then I just did it every other month just to keep them happy and the insurance companies happy. So, that's the-- And still, in all those almost 14,000 patients, there was only one patient who had a problem with Sporanox, and that was a lady who came and told me I have total insomnia. And sure enough, it's in the package insert as one of the potential side effects, insomnia, not liver. So, I use that to help patients get rid of the colonization. And that's going to eventually lead to also some Herxheimer reaction in those patients in weeks or months.
[01:10:28] Scott: Do you find that that generally is enough, or do you also combine it with herbs or other natural antifungals as well.
[01:10:37] Andrew: I usually like to combine it with other herbs and antifungal, natural antifungals. Olive leaf extract is an example. People say that oregano will do it. Well, if that were true, no Italian would have any fungal problem. But they do. I have patients from there and they use oregano in everything. They have it for breakfast. So, you know, I'm not sure that that's really a great, but other-- anything that helps, and you've got to remember to ask your patient, “Is this helping? How do you feel?” I used to see my patients once a month when they could. If they came from long distances, I'd have to see them once every six weeks or two months. Or sometimes do Skype calls for those in Australia and New Zealand, Hong Kong, etc. So, the big question, how do you feel?
[01:11:42] Scott: For those people that are interested in the MyMycoLab, tell us a little bit about the cost, whether or not they need to have a doctor to order it or sign the requisition. How do they go about getting access to doing this testing?
[01:11:56] Andrew: I've seen patients who are affected by this who have limited funds. So, I deliberately kept the price lower. It's at under $16 per antibody, which is unheard of. So, we-- and I did this on purpose. I want people at all levels, economic levels to be able to access this test. It's 380 bucks. Just get on the website, whether you're a clinician, I don't care whether you're a chiropractor or a naturopath, or MD or DO or-- If you're seeing patients, that's what matters. If you're helping people feel better, that's what matters. Or if you're just a person and you live in a community where you don't have that access, you can also do it.
[01:12:52] Scott: So, it does not require a clinician to order it, it sounds like?
[01:12:55] Andrew: Does not.
[01:12:56] Scott: Okay. If people are interested in learning more about you, your practice, potentially working with you; are you taking new patients? How can they find you?
[01:13:05] Andrew: I've limited my practice as you could imagine because I also speak at about 20 different conferences a year all over the world. That includes overseas such as Oxford University in England. I have four coming up in Mexico over the next five weeks. So, I've limited the patients. Patients can still access me through what we're doing right now, which is a great tool of computers in the internet age. So, I leave that available so they don't have to fly like they used to back 20-30 years ago. And I don't really have a website anymore. I've kind of gone away from that because honestly, most people find me through the literature, the almost 100 studies that I've published, they just find me that way.
[01:14:05] Scott: My last question is the same for each guest and that is, what are some of the key things that you do on a daily basis in support of your own health?
[01:14:12] Andrew: My own health. You know, I think love is very powerful. So, I think you know, of course, love your family, love whatever God you worship, and love people, be kind to them, be nice to them, and I think that will keep you well, longer than it-- be nice to animals as well, wild or otherwise. Love everything, love all creation.
[01:14:43] Scott: That's the first time in 114 shows that I think I've gotten that answer. I enjoyed that. Thank you. That was fantastic and so important. I think we forget sometimes that the next solution isn't always in a pill or a capsule or a softgel or something of that nature. This has been a fun conversation having myself been impacted by mold illness and mycotoxin illness, having tools like this is always of interest. I appreciate your time today in educating us about the tool that you have available, and all of your experience in helping people over the years with mold and mycotoxin illness. Just want to thank you and honor you for being here today, and for all that you do to help others. So, thank you so much, Dr. Campbell.
[01:15:26] Andrew: Thank you for having me. I've really enjoyed the conversation too. And rarely do I get such intelligent questions asked of me. Usually, they're a no brainer.
[01:15:36] Scott: Thank you so much.
[01:15:38] Scott: To learn more about today's guest visit MyMycoLab.com. That's MyMycoLab.com, MyMycoLab.com. Thanks for your interest in today's show. If you'd like to follow me on Facebook or Twitter you can find me there as Better Health Guy. To support the show please visit BetterHealthGuy.com/donate. If you'd like to be added to my newsletter, visit BetterHealthGuy.com/newsletters, and this and other shows can be found on YouTube, iTunes, Google Play, Stitcher and Spotify.
[01:16:16] Thanks for listening to this BetterHealthGuy Blogcast with Scott, your Better Health Guy. To check out additional shows and learn more about Scott's personal journey to better health, please visit BetterHealthGuy.com.
The content of this show is for informational purposes only and is not intended to diagnose, treat, or cure any illness or medical condition. Nothing in today's discussion is meant to serve as medical advice or as information to facilitate self-treatment. As always, please discuss any potential health-related decisions with your own personal medical authority.