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In this episode, you will learn about the latest in biological medicine in the treatment of complex, chronic illnesses.

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About My Guest

My guest for this episode is Dr. Dietrich Klinghardt.  Dietrich Klinghardt, MD, PhD studied medicine and psychology in Freiburg, Germany, completing his PhD on the involvement of the autonomic nervous system in autoimmune disorders. Early in his career he became interested in the sequelae of chronic toxicity (especially lead, mercury, environmental pollutants, and electromagnetic fields) for the course of illness.  While working in India, Dr. Klinghardt encountered Eastern concepts of disease etiology and blended them with his Western training. This laid the foundation for his 5-level system of Integrative Medicine. In the US, he spent three years as a full-time emergency physician before becoming Medical Director of the Santa Fe Pain Centre.  Increasingly aware of the limitations of conventional medicine when dealing with chronic conditions, he trained in Ericksonian hypnotherapy and began to include body-oriented psychotherapeutic and counseling approaches in his work, along with neural therapy, mesotherapy injection techniques, and Applied PsychoNeurobiology.  Dr. Klinghardt has contributed significantly to the understanding of metal toxicity and its connection with chronic infections, illness, and pain. He has been instrumental in advancing various fields within biological medicine: non-invasive pain management, injection techniques for pain and orthopedic dysfunction, anti-aging medicine, toxicology, pediatrics (neuro-developmental disorders), energy psychology, biological dentistry, and others.  He developed Autonomic Response Testing, a comprehensive evaluation system that has helped many practitioners to become accomplished holistic physicians.  He founded Sophia Health Institute in 2012 and is actively involved in patient care at his clinic.

Key Takeaways

  • How should detoxification of the five primary toxicants be approached?
  • What is the primary trigger of Mast Cell Activation Syndrome?
  • What is the role of melatonin in detoxification?
  • What are the latest thoughts on the potential downsides of 5G?
  • What role does mold exposure play in chronic illness?
  • What are the common considerations in the treatment of PANS?
  • How might hypermobility, EDS, and CCI be approached?
  • When is the right time to start supporting the mitochondria?
  • How important is considering hypercoagulation in recovering health?
  • How has treatment shifted since starting retroviral silencing protocols?

Connect With My Guest

http://KlinghardtInstitute.com
http://SophiaHI.com

Interview Date

September 12, 2020 

Transcript

Transcript Disclaimer: Transcripts are intended to provide optimized access to information contained in the podcast.  They are not a full replacement for the discussion.  Timestamps are provided to facilitate finding portions of the conversation.  Errors and omissions may be present as the transcript is not created by someone familiar with the topics being discussed.  Please Contact Me with any corrections.   

[00:00:01.03] Welcome to BetterHealthGuy Blogcasts, empowering your better health. And now, here's Scott, your Better Health Guy.

[00:00:13.26] The content of this show is for informational purposes only and is not intended to diagnose, treat, or cure any illness or medical condition. Nothing in today's discussion is meant to serve as medical advice or as information to facilitate self-treatment. As always, please discuss any potential health-related decisions with your own personal medical authority.

[00:00:34.25] Scott: Hello everyone, and welcome to episode number 127 of the BetterHealthGuy Blogcasts series. Today's guest is Dr. Dietrich Klinghardt, and the topic of the show is Klinghardt Conversations 3. Dr. Dietrich Klinghardt studied medicine and psychology in Freiburg, Germany completing his Ph.D. on the involvement of the autonomic nervous system in autoimmune disorders.

Early in his career, he became interested in the sequelae of chronic toxicity: especially lead, mercury, environmental pollutants, and electromagnetic fields and their contribution to chronic illness. While working in India, Dr. Klinghardt encountered eastern concepts of disease etiology and blended them with his western training.

This laid the foundation for his five-level system of integrative medicine. In the United States, he spent three years as a full-time emergency physician before becoming medical director of the Santa Fe Pain Center. Increasingly aware of the limitations of conventional medicine when dealing with chronic conditions, he trained in Ericksonian hypnotherapy and began to include body-oriented psychotherapeutic and counseling approaches in his work.

Along with neural therapy, Mesotherapy, injection techniques, and Applied PsychoNeurobiology, Dr. Klinghardt has contributed significantly to the understanding of metal toxicity and its connection with chronic infections, illness, and pain. He has been instrumental in advancing various fields within biological medicine, including non-invasive pain management, injection techniques for pain, and orthopedic dysfunction, anti-aging medicine, toxicology, pediatrics, including neuro-developmental disorders, energy psychology, biological dentistry, and others.

He developed Autonomic Response Testing, a comprehensive evaluation system that has helped many practitioners to become accomplished holistic providers. He founded Sophia Health Institute in 2012 and is actively involved in patient care at his clinic.

And now, my third interview with Dr. Dietrich Klinghardt.

It is an honor today to have Dr. Klinghardt back on the podcast for our third conversation in our series Klinghardt Conversations. It's been two years since our last podcast together, and having him on the show today is a great honor for me. Thanks for being here, Dr. Klinghardt.

[00:03:00.23] Dr. Klinghardt: Thank you, Scott. I lost a few more hairs since we last talked.

[00:03:06.13] Scott: You've talked about the four primary environmental toxicants being Glyphosate, Aluminum, Fluoride, and then the EMRs or EMFs. Would you place environmental toxicants at the top of the list in terms of the contributors to the health challenges that many in our population experience today? And then at a high level, what are some of the primary strategies that you would share for detoxifying from the plethora of environmental exposures that we're all exposed to?

[00:03:36.15] Dr. Klinghardt: Yes. There is a hierarchy amongst the toxic influences that we have. I would, by the way, add mercury definitely into that list, so I would make it five. So let's just shoot, so it's very clear that, for example, there is not a single one of our enzyme systems that's not blocked by mercury.

There is not a single enzyme system that is not up-regulated, down-regulated, blocked, or even destroyed by the Wi-Fi environment. So these are just two examples. And then all of us are toxic with lead, lead toxicity, I think, is a bit overlooked by many because lead largely is stored in the bones. It replaces calcium as you're growing up, and there is lead exchange for calcium into the bones. And the bones are like a faraday cage; there are very few methods even with our energetic testing.  You have to use also trickery to actually detect it.

And lead is probably the hardest to get out, and I start with that because there is a myth in America that you can decrease lead with EDTA, you can. It's a study that shows to get the lead content to half of what it was before, if you do once a week a three hour IV, it will take seven years to achieve that, that's not realistic. I mean, it's good for the physician providing that, but it's not realistic for the patient. So one unique place in lead detox is vitamin B1. Vitamin B1 is the only vitamin that has a sulfhydryl group. Just like DMPS or DMSA has, your glutathione has. And thiamine is enormously important and effective for that. We had to re-learn about thiamine from using Disulfiram in Lyme disease as a co-administrated item to prevent side effects. And so, I’d forgotten about B1, but this is a hugely important item for lead toxicity.

The other one that I heavily rely on is my mentor Dr. Omura, who did a wonderful study. Who showed that these seven years can be shortened to 39 days by using a special extract from cilantro? It's a product called MIC Cilantro. It's. Basically, there is in a pill of cilantro; there is about three to four pounds of cilantro extract in there; the part that detoxes lead, aluminum, and mercury. So you get three for the price of one, it's expensive, but it works.

Okay, so that's a little bit about lead. Now glyphosate, of course, to use the Latin word pars pro toto, there is thousands of chemicals that are used out in the environment as bisphenol A, and there is the flame retardants, the PBDEs you know the list is endless also. But we found really based on the work from Stephanie Seneff, that at least in the US, glyphosate takes an absolute leading role.

First of all, it's by volume the most used herbicide and drying agent that serves many purposes in the agricultural industry. But is by volume, the most important in our environment and therefore also in our body. And the research shows is many cancers are linked to it; many neurological illnesses are linked to glyphosate. Certainly, and this has sort of been the focus lately, is that glyphosate certainly alters our gut microbiome most likely.

Not just our gut microbiome but also the sinus microbiome, which we'll probably talk about. The microbiome in the eyes, on the skin, and everything. Because it blocks the Shikimate pathway, which is something most of our bacteria have. And when the bacteria ingest glyphosate, it blocks the pathway, and they become dysfunctional or die. And then when they die, they're releasing that back into their immediate environment, and the next generation of bugs gobbles that up and also gets paralyzed. And so glyphosate is a really hidden evil. 

In Europe, there's another company, Syngenta in Switzerland, who creates other evil substances that are more widely spread in Europe, that have similar evil effects on our system. And so looking through the studies or so, we found a detox program that works very well that can rehabilitate the gut, and the other systems are affected, and we use peat extract. Peat is from these high Moore lake, these black lakes defined in the mountains, and these are fermented trees and plants millions of years old. And the more well-known compounds in it are fulvic acid and humic acid. But there is thousands of other compounds in there; nobody really knows for absolutely sure which one of them is the one that is detoxing. And the interesting thing, it doesn't just detox the gut, but this stuff is absorbed in our system. And detox is the brain and the teeth and the eyes and whatever the glyphosate has made its way to.

And then we pair that up with glycine, with the amino acid glycine, because glyphosate was developed of the molecule of the amino acid glycine. And so they compete with each other for attachment. And Stephanie Seneff also showed that the enzymes that our pancreas produces all having critical places, the amino acid glycine, and it gets replaced with glyphosate in the absence of glycine. And then the enzymes are there when you measure them in our lab work that we do, and everything looks good.

But the patient functionally has a huge enzyme deficiency, and the fact is that these enzymes don't work. They look like enzymes, they're there in the common tests that we use, but they're dysfunctional. And so by replacing glycine with the nutrition quite abundantly, we see wonderful the combination of peat extract and glycine is a fantastic tool for that. The average lead contained in our bones is 400 to 1000 times higher than it was 200 years ago.

There are good studies on that. The mercury content of the ambient air in California that was measured is 200 times higher than it was 200 years ago. This is the air, you don't even need to have a silver amalgam filling, or you don't need a flu vaccine injected in order to get the mercury into you. Mercury, as you know, at room temperature, dissolves and becomes a gas they can't see. And that when you break a thermometer, and you have the little beads of mercury floating around, they dissolve within a few hours, maybe a day or two.

And where do they go, they don't go into the table? They go into the air, and they can persist there for decades? They don't float high up into the sky, but they stay sort of in the first five, six, eight meters close to the ground in the air, and that's the air that we're breathing, it's the air the trees are breathing. Oh, by the way, because of the fires, I want to make that remark. Because of the mercury vapor in the air, trees and many plants pick up this vapor in their metabolic activity. We know that trees breathe CO2 in and breathe out oxygen, just the reverse of how we function.

But they're also breathing in mercury vapor. And for example pine needles have astronomical amounts of mercury in them. And when you burn a tree, I think this is very relevant to our time. When you burn a tree, there's a huge plume of mercury and other toxic metals released back in the air. And we already see in my patients that just came in the last few days, astronomical acute signs of mercury toxicity, of arsenic toxicity, of cadmium toxicity. Patients that were completely detoxed and doing fine for many years and suddenly have these acute signs, and it turns out they've been breathing that was their mistake. Well, I think this is really relevant, and so we always pair the metal detox with the use of a binder.

That means when we first ingest, inhale, or inject mercury with the vaccine or eat fish; there's a mercury level that rises in the blood because some of it gets absorbed into the blood and stays there for no longer than six weeks. And then it distributes into all the tissues in the body. While it's in the blood, it's easy to get it out. And that is through the gut. So we place substances in the gut that we refer to as binders that have a high affinity for mercury, for that, for other metals.

And in the gut, the separation between the inner lumen of the blood vessels that are so richly in the gut wall, the separation from the blood to the inside lumen of the gut, there's only one single cell layer. Which usually, on the skin, you have like thousands, hundreds of thousands of layers between the outside of the skin and the first blood vessel. And what happens when you cut it or slice it, then you get to it. But otherwise, you're pretty stable.

But in the gut, when you have a binder on board, it extracts out of the blood through that one single cell layer. The things that it has a higher affinity to than the proteins in the blood have. And as you know, we use chlorella as our binder; we use the one from BioPure because we regularly have their chlorella checked for the content of heavy metals. Because a high affinity of binders that really are effective have a high affinity for the stuff, and if the stuff is in the air.

There's going to be some in the binder, but it needs to be bound in a way that is not released when we're eating it. And so we regularly check that the chlorella from BioPure that fulfills all of our criteria. Okay, so mercury, I already mentioned the cilantro extract; we also make liposomal cilantro tincture here. So from BioPure, they have a special concentrate of an alcoholic extract of cilantro. And then be adding in about if we're mixing in a bottle five parts of cilantro tincture on one part of phospholipids.

We put that in an ultrasonic jewelry cleaner that costs about 20 or 30 bucks. I think I’ve learned that from you many years ago. And vibrate it for 15 minutes, and that creates a wonderful liposomal mix of cilantro that is highly absorbed and crosses cell membranes everywhere in the body. And that's how we mobilize mercury very effectively from the brain, from other substances. I like to recently also add in some curcumin tincture; curcumin has been shown to be quite effective on its own to get mercury on the move. So that's a little bit of mercury, and then the big one really that's affecting all of us no matter who we are is the combination really of electrosmog, aluminum, and glyphosate all work together. Yes, I'll explain that in a moment.

So let's talk briefly about aluminum. Chris Exley, Professor Chris, actually from England, just published maybe two months ago a beautiful new study looking at the content of aluminum in central nervous system disease. Parkinson's, MS, ALS, and autism. And in all of them, he found compared to the control brains of rejected astronomical elevation of aluminum. Boyd Haley published the study; this was maybe 20 years ago when I worked closely with him. He was the mercury guru in the world, Professor Boyd Haley, University of Kentucky.

He did the initial study on Alzheimer’s disease and found that mercury was a more important player than aluminum. It turns out; first of all, the measuring methods that were available at the time weren't able to detect the full catastrophe of aluminum at the time. It was inhibited with the methods. And secondly, mercury and aluminum have a catastrophic synergistic effect several studies on that. And so aluminum on its own may not be devastatingly toxic, but the moment you have the tiniest amount of mercury on board, aluminum, mercury, the combination becomes catastrophic.

And then Stephanie Seneff told us that aluminum and glyphosate create actually a new novel compound in our system, aluminoglyphosate. And that's a new molecule, and that molecule is absolutely devastating to our health. And so detoxing aluminum has become a passion of mine over the last 15 years. And again, cilantro that is one of the things published by Omura as has been very effective in mobilizing aluminum if you combine it with a binder, either chlorella or zeolite.

But the big contribution that a friend of mine, a neurologist in London did, is investigating the effect of the so-called ionic foot bath. You know foot bath there's a coil, electric coil put in the water that runs a current through it. The water has to be slightly salty; put your feet in it. And then it was sort of wrongly marketed for decades because then the water turns a certain color and that is completely irrelevant. But what she did there was a revolution; she spent about a hundred thousand Euros on 20 patients on every two hours after the foot bath to measuring the excretion of aluminum in the urine.

And they found individual differences between patients, that between the hours eight of the foot bath and three days after the foot bath, there is an astronomical peak of aluminum excretion in the urine. Not in the foot bath, not in the water, but it, the foot bath, triggers the body's ability to release aluminum from inside the cells, from the tissues, from everywhere. And we call it foot bath, but now we do two to one, for each two foot bath, we do one handbath. And friends of ours used the principle in autistic children and did a study on the so-called ATEC score showing that within four months, the ATEC score, that's the score of severity of autism, reduced by more than half just with the single use of the foot bath four times a week for 30 minutes.

And looking back, Chris actually did this beautiful study linking autism very clearly to the level of aluminum in the brain. And since the foot bath has been shown now in various experiments to be dramatic in decreasing the aluminum content system. None of the studies you know my neurologist friend tried to publish this study, she got like it is often the case now she basically got threatening letters from the editors that is better if she doesn't go that way, and she should attend to other things in her life.

And so it was never published, but we have the raw data, and it was very convincing. I’ve been doing that now for 15 years. And it's for detoxing aluminum, for all of us who like our brains and want to keep it, it's a fantastic tool. And then that only leaves the discussion on the electrosmog, and of course, to protect ourselves from that, it's not an art. You need some real physics for that. This is sort of where people make mistakes.

People mistake physics and metaphysics, yes. You cannot protect yourself from the influence of Wi-Fi, from radio waves by putting a symbol around your neck that some guru has given you. We just have not found anything that has diminished the catastrophic effect on the system. I think the best studies on the influence of Wi-Fi this is a Bioinitiative report that was done a few years ago that sums up many of the papers that were out at the time.

More recently, our friend Marty Pall, Professor Pall, has written a beautiful review paper on it and came to the conclusion that probably the most devastating mechanism is that it alters the function of the voltage-gated calcium channel. When calcium enters the cell, the cell starts aging, that's number one. The main process of aging, calcium in the cell. But calcium in the cell then triggers a series of biochemical reactions, where at the end, different nitrogen compounds are produced in the cell that are extremely oxidative and extremely toxic to our system.

The most common one is peroxynitrite; it's the same substance that rockets are flying with, this rocket fuel. And the mitochondria are producing that after the influx of calcium in the cell. And so when we're in a high Wi-Fi environment, everywhere in the body, in the neurons, in the brain, and your eyes and your teeth, in your heart, in your bladder. Calcium, there is an increased calcium influx. So first of all, it means the tissues are aging, but secondly, it means you have these hugely toxic and inflammatory compounds that are created.

And I know you probably will ask me about the eternal mast cell activation syndrome later, but you have to look no further. I would suggest even this, and I’m really sort of get more hostile with this as I get older.

Anyone who talks about the mast cell activation syndrome who doesn't start the lecture when you're looking at the reasons with the Wi-Fi, I would leave the room. Because I know the guy hasn't looked, or girl hasn't looked, at the recent evidence of that, okay. Why would the mast cell activation, why would that increase dramatically in the last few years? And you can do a graph of the increase, and it directly parallels the graph of extreme increase of Wi-Fi exposure. We're bathed in the sea of radio waves, and there is radar, radar was always at the high-frequency range of whatever 28 to 60 gigahertz.

The middle range the 3G and 4G that we had that was always based on the carrier frequency of 2.4 gigahertz. That's the most studied; that's a frequency that causes cancer. It's a frequency that sterilizes whole populations over two or three generations. It's a frequency that is linked to severe neurological disease, and that frequency was picked about 20 years ago as the main carrier frequency in the west, even though this research was known.

It's a crime against humanity, and I have, of course, a lot to say about that. But in terms of detoxing, so first of all, the more, the higher body burden of metals you have, and your metals are resonant with Wi-Fi. And the more higher your metal content is, and that includes unfortunately also the good metals, like zinc and copper and molybdenum, the things that you need. But the higher your metal content is, and largely related now to the aluminum burden and that burden, the abnormal position of toxic minerals in our system.

That creates an antenna where our whole body is an antenna, and that changes with body weight; it changes with how much you are exercising and sweating. But this antenna is what receives Wi-Fi. And so one way of tweaking the antenna function is by detoxing metals. Now we see wonderful, lessening of electro hypersensitivity in people. And we see, and I cannot prove that the main thing, of course, is the shortening of the lifespan that this is causing. And the increases of all illnesses that shorten the lifespan like cancer, and heart disease, and Alzheimer’s disease.

So the sum total of the effect of Wi-Fi is devastating. And it was only published a few days ago that something that you heard me say, Scott, like 10, 15 years ago when we first got together. But is this eternal lie about the life expectancy. So now the official statistic shows that the life expectancy has rapidly gone downhill since the year 2010, yes. So that's now finally official, and I can say it now loudly that we've known that. And it is going down exponentially, it's not going down with a slow nice curve, but it's going down and so. And the Wi-Fi certainly I would put in the number one position of that. And so metal detox is important, and the second one is that there's certainly herbal extracts like rosemary that has been shown to be hugely radio-protective to the cells.

That's one thing, then secondly. We know the high-frequency range of 5G doesn't penetrate very deeply; it penetrates a few millimeters through the skin and causes most of the damage there. And you can fortify the skin with certain skin creams that contain certain of the herbs. There's one that I’m using from KI science; it's called E-Shield, E-Shield that's been fantastic. People that couldn't sleep or that had the EHS, electro hypersensitivity syndrome, clearly give feedback after a few days.

Oh my god, this really works. Then you can wear on top of that radioprotective clothing that looks like a mirror that bounces back Wi-Fi the BioPure has that, the one that I like. And then, of course, it's like shielding your home or shielding your bed location, either with the canopy with silver-coated cloth. Or there is the carbon-based wall paint; it's a conductive wall paint that can turn either your bedroom or the bed of your whole house into a faraday cage or your office, that’s pretty much it. Largely, the damage that's caused is oxidative.

Antioxidants some of them are really helpful. Largely, this is sort of where in spite of my opposition, glutathione and alpha-lipoic acid may play a role. But the studies that I’m aware of from England and Germany that the herbal compounds like propolis and rosemary and Gingko biloba, maybe the three big ones, are far more effective as antioxidants than the industrial vitamin-based compounds. I think that's all I can say on the, in terms of what we're doing here.

[00:29:45.23] Scott: Coming back to the mercury in the air, where I am here in northern California as well. I’ve often joked with people that one strategy is to hold your breath, but that no one's ever had long-term success with that strategy. And I do want to mention too with the cilantro, and I think correct me if you disagree with this. But I think people should be aware that it is a very potent mobilizing tool.

And if you're not working with a practitioner that understands detoxification, that has the drainage pathways and emunctories open. It's not a great tool if somebody has metal in the body or amalgams, for example. So you want to use that cautiously because it can mobilize things, and some people may not be ready for that. So for those of you that may not be working with a practitioner, I would urge caution with that tool or starting very low and slow.

Coming back to the binder conversation, a listener asked if you would recommend being on some type of binder for life as a strategy for mitigating the environmental soup of toxicants. And then also kind of looking at the different binders, do you recommend using them daily long term? Do you recommend that certain ones need to be pulsed or paused? Are there any of them that we should be maybe not using every day long term?

[00:30:59.11] Dr. Klinghardt: Binders, they're all different. They have a high affinity, high binding capacity for certain toxins. But there's no binder that binds everything. And well, there is one that's charcoal. And I know in our community, some of our best friends are putting people on lifelong strategies with charcoal. And it turns out that none of these friends are actually seeing patients anymore. And so they don't observe the damage.

So charcoal preferably binds your fat-soluble vitamins, binds fat-soluble toxins, all right. But it also binds your vitamin D or vitamin E, vitamin K, vitamin A and some of your precious fatty acids. And so any binder, this is at least, I’m making the statement very clear here. Any binder that contains charcoal should only be used for a few days at a time, and the patient should seek out a binder that is safe for long-term use.

That is selective; that doesn't gobble up the precious things in your food. And so I’m not going to say any names here, but binders that contain charcoal, use them for the bad days when the patient has a crisis. So usually the days when you go way up with the binders. That's by the way, one strategy how we use binders that we don't use them at all, but on days when you have dipping when you go downhill, then to really eat; take a lot of it.

And a lot of it I explained that there's a group of moms in Switzerland that have cured the children just with chlorella alone. And however, a six-year-old would typically take between 120 and 180 tablets of chlorella a day. Now it's still very cost-effective compared to what moms do here, but this is sort of like when I say high dose, that's a high dose. And so for me, the only binder that I allow people to take lifelong is chlorella. Chlorella half the bodyweight of chlorella is amino acids and exactly the same distribution as a mother's milk.

It contains methyl B12; it contains zinc; it has a lot of magnesium, of course, in it like all the green things too. And so Chlorella is an intelligent binder; it's a plant that binds things that are toxic for the plant, but not things that the plants need to eat. And they're very similar algae, have a very similar nutritional needs to us, humans.

And so by taking chlorella, it selectively binds things that are bad for us. But does not or hardly bind things that are good for us. So that's the only binder I allow people to take forever. And then Zeolite, so it takes a middle position. Zeolite is a funny volcanic ash that has an interesting structure of like lots of hollow tube space that very firmly binds certain things. It's very good in binding a lot of chemicals, bisphenol A, PBDEs, farming chemicals, including Chlorella, and that's the only binder that binds fluoride.

Fluoride is, of course, a huge issue in the US. Fluoride dumbs down the population; we see what happened in the last 50 years of fluoridating the US drinking water. The IQ of the US has moved below the average of the IQ in western countries, which is a really sad thing. When I moved here, that was in ’82, we were all looking up to America as this incredible country, which it really was.

But I observed the decline and the intelligence; you can just look at the politicians and the some of the interviews or movie actors or so where you wonder how these people got into their position. So I tend to use those binders charcoal, activated charcoal for acute situations. Zeolite I like to do for six weeks, eight weeks, and then pause. Chlorella, I would not hesitate to give for your whole life. I know there are other things that bind; I should maybe mention a few here.

One is fiber the natural way of binding toxins is a high fiber content in the diet. And so this is now a serious answer, so what I have very often families do to juice vegetables, and then give the actual juice to the healthiest family member. But everybody who is unhealthy eats the fiber that comes out on the other end of the machine.

And makes that the main foods staple that's eaten throughout the day. So when you make a six-ounce glass of vegetable juice, the fiber that comes out with that will keep you busy the whole day, and that's a fantastic binder. And then for the hormonal issues, we're not going to go into that. But the incredible amount of xenoestrogens and the hormone breakdown products.

So the liver is trying to shelf all that out into the gut. And unfortunately, the glyphosate corrupted microbiome tends to reconstitute hormone residues back to full estrogens and estrones and some of the cancer-causing estrogen-like substances. And the fiber that completely binds that very firmly is from flaxseeds, ground flaxseed that you can get at Whole Foods or whatever, the health food stores should be kept in the fridge.

And I mean once you grind flaxseed, this affects oil and it oxidizes. And so when you buy these things that are vacuum-packed in bags, and usually it's enough a heaping teaspoon once a day, I like mine in yogurt. But then it's really important that you keep the bag in the fridge or even in the freezer, so the fatty acids don't oxidize any further than they do. That's a binder I’ve more believe everybody should do; I think we'll leave it there.

[00:37:45.13] Scott: Thanks to you, I had my tablespoon of flax this morning and my power shake, so thank you, sir.

Let's talk a little bit more just on the 5G conversation. I’m interested in whether or not you think that this is as big of a concern as some people like to express at this point.

I know there's a lot of panic around 5G; it sounds like 5G itself primarily affects the skin, does not penetrate deeply into the body. But that the larger concern might be having more towers that are also broadcasting the current cell communications. And so when we look at things like the shielding materials, the canopies, the paint and so on. Do they block 5G, or do we really need to care? Is the focus really still on the existing cellular communications?

[00:38:36.17] Dr. Klinghardt: Yes. So I want to answer that indirectly, and then give you some ideas on that. So first of all, to reestablish the 5G tends to use three distinct ranges of microwave. So not the entire spectrum, so microwave has a huge spectrum. So they use a low lower frequency range that was always used by the police and fire engine departments, and that has been shown to greatly cripple the brains of firemen.

And that low-frequency range is very hard to shield or not shieldable at all. It goes through our canopy, it goes through the faraday cage paint or so, and exerts its effect that's really bad. However, it's directional, depending on where the cell phone tower is blasting; it goes pretty much like a beam in that direction. The second range is around the 2.4 gigahertz, that's what we had, and then there is a high range of 28 to 60 gigahertz. We were familiar with already with radar, and we know, like from my experience with patients from San Diego that live close to the airport or close to the military bases there, they're exposed to high levels of radar.

It has destroyed their lives. I mean they have chronic fatigue, they can't open their eyes, they're so fatigued. And so we have that and the more recent evidence the first outbreak of COVID-19 in the US was next to my office, basically at the Evergreen hospital. And I went there to see what was going on, and they had a death rate of sixty percent death rate. So the first ten patients that were brought there, six died.

And of course, their relatives knew me, and they came desperate, what can we do? Are we all going to die? And I said no, we had a very good treatment in place and that worked beautifully. But it went and measured, and it turns out that Evergreen hospital was one of the first hospitals in the US that months before had activated the 5G network. And the entire community Kirkland suburb of Seattle was one of only five communities in the whole U.S. that had fully activated 5G about August of 2019.

And so it has a taste to it that probably was involved with it. And also then there's a Spanish researcher who did a beautiful map of Spain, showing the communities where 5G was already in action, and the death rates of COVID-19 and they're identical maps. So there is that, but then there is the signs that we know so far, is that the low frequencies go straight through the body.

And they were there all along, and my question is all the people that are protesting now, where were they when the police was blasted with this and people died across the street from police stations and from fire stations because they were blasted. Where were my friends then? And the other thing is the 2.4 gigahertz, now the middle range of this, as I mentioned before, that's the voltage-gated calcium channel with all the inflammatory products, therefore. Where were my friends then? We have this now for 20 years.

Some of us have been preaching this is deadly to our human race, deadly to many plants, deadly to the insects, deadly to the bees, where were my friends? And now the 5G is coming, and everybody is on the floor. So I’m not against that, and I’m glad you're waking up. But you were asleep for a long time before. And so the thing that you mentioned is very critical, for 5G, for the high frequencies, the higher the frequencies are, the shorter the range.

And so for 5G to work and especially for the driverless cars, which we were all longing for. To finally sit in the car without having to drive, right? That's really the reason given why we need this technology. So for 5G to work, you need to have a cell phone emitting device every 50 to 100 yards. It used to be every half a mile for 3G; now it's every 50 to 100 yards. And if you draw that out, that means even on a good day; there is 30 to 40 times more mass; more emitting devices than there were before in the 5G area.

And as it turned out, there is no 5G installed without running the old 3G with it. And the 3G we know for sure is sterilizing populations; it's creating neurological disease. It's resonant with the Aluminum in the brain. It does all the evil things that you want anything to do. And so now having 30, 40, 50 times more emitting devices in everybody's neighborhood will be a disaster, and we know that already. And I mentioned the COVID-19 thing here; nobody can get anything published, nobody can get any research money on this.

So you will not be able to look at Google now and find a sophisticated study that confirms what I’m saying here, no. I mean, all the medical media are tightly controlled now by the special interest, you don't get anything in there anymore. And we're all watching basic the demise of humanity, and the media are silent about it. The media have completely failed to inform us in a timely fashion truthfully about the dangers of these things. And so we're on our own with this one.

[00:44:34.23] Scott: So it sounds like the 5G itself is not as much the concern as the exponential increase of the 3G and 4G that we've had for some time.

[00:44:45.24] Dr. Klinghardt: Absolutely.

[00:44:46.21] Scott: Okay. Let's talk a little bit about melatonin; you've said that melatonin is one of your favorite detoxification agents, more so than glutathione. You've talked about it being anti-microbial. I’ve taken melatonin every day for many years. And back in 2006, when we first met, you said that that was likely what saved me.

Many people feel that the effects of toxins with high-dose melatonin certainly is something to be aware of, not jumping in too much without someone like yourself to guide them. But not everybody has access to a Dr. Klinghardt. And so can you talk to us a little bit about is there a way to incorporate melatonin? Are there some potential concerns or landmines that can come with it? And how can people utilize it, but do it in a safe way that's not necessarily going to stir the pot?

[00:45:37.11] Dr. Klinghardt: And I think one of the things that anybody can see who's watching this is that looking at you, you still look like you're 24 years old. And it can only be the melatonin, sort of I started too late in my life. I started probably, and we talked about this once, probably ten years after you did.

So there is a journal of pioneer research for the science interested people here and all the key papers in the journal Professor Reiter in Houston. He's sort of the world expert. And what has emerged is that in our community, we've been always stressing glutathione, and glutathione is the main antioxidant in the brain if you want to protect the brain. And then all of us injected the hell out of people, and we saw very little progress in our Alzheimer’s patients and the sick patients.

And then, the literature started emerging a far more important detox agent, and anti-inflammatory for the intracellular component of our cells in the body was melatonin. And the melatonin on its own has strong antiviral effects and used for sepsis, one of the most deadly human conditions is sepsis, and it beautifully stops that.

With COVID-19, I advise several physicians that run emergency departments in large hospitals in Saudi Arabia and Australia, and other places, and people that followed my advice they had virtually a zero death rate by including melatonin against the so-called cytokine storm that nobody really knows if that really exists or not. But that dive that COVID patients took at least initially when the virus was more aggressive.

And so melatonin has a huge plethora of effects. But when you Google, when you put in melatonin and mercury, you find out that it basically undoes the lethal effects of mercury instantly. When you Google aluminum and melatonin, same thing, Glyphosate and melatonin.

So melatonin has really like a huge range of spectrum of things that it does. And one of the things that has emerged, and I used that for like almost 30 years after meeting Professor Reiter, people with active cancers. We put always on 200 milligrams melatonin.

There's a company in the US Bulk Supplements where you can get like a kilo of melatonin for like 300 bucks; it goes a long way. And then friends of mine in Germany were experimenting with transdermal melatonin to get other additional effects like with breast cancer. If you put the cream around the breast or thyroid cancer, you can get amazing positive effects on that. And then we start also experimenting with suppositories.

What you're after with melatonin is a more sustained effect. When you take it orally, most of the effect is like within half an hour or an hour, and you get a high peak and a good effect. But then, it kind of goes down. Also, what people don't know is that 200, we all know about the melatonin being produced in the pineal gland.

Well, every cell in the body is producing small amounts of melatonin for its own inner housekeeping. And what most people don't know is that our gut microbiome creates 200 to 400 times more melatonin than a pineal gland in the gut. But that happens at high noon, so exactly opposite to the midnight when the pineal gland releases melatonin to induce sleep.

The gut microbiome uses melatonin as the self-regulation communication molecule, how the bugs talk to each other, and it's very important. And so we started in cancer patients to mimic the normal biorhythm, we use suppositories at night, and we use the high dose oral at the peak of the day, and then we use a cream for more sustained release.

Because it has these strong anti-cancer properties. And so with me, it's pretty much part of every protocol that I write. Yes, now the downside of that that you're asking about is by neutralizing toxins and disinflaming the tissues, the tissues start releasing aluminum, mercury, and all sorts of toxic things that we've never heard about.

And when a cell releases something toxic, the toxin inside the cell is the most common trigger for autoimmune disease. It means that there is circulating cells of the immune system that see the cell that has something awful in it and starts attacking the cell. But these are reactions that play out over years slowly. Now, if the toxin comes out of the cell and it's in the extracellular space. The cells of the immune system macrophages and other directly get in contact with that and create a huge wild reaction.

You know they're talking to each other, they give this alarm signal oh my god, we got a horrible invader here. Please, everybody comes to help. And so when you use melatonin initially on this, some people that start like three weeks into taking it some on the first day, some a year into it people get reactions that look like acute toxicity. People can't sleep; they feel like they're on coffee; they feel their brain is inflamed. And yes, that happens. And so it's best to be done under the guidance of a practitioner. The universal antidote when somebody calls in and go through this that I give people is the DMSA, and DMSA is widely available.

Usually, it's one of the sulfhydryl affinitive metals and then in that case. But this doesn't take a small dose of the DMSA, this I give like 500 milligrams every four to six hours for a couple of days until the patient is through the crisis. That does not cover the aluminum or the iron, which can also be involved for that. We need the foot bath, and the Cilantro and Desferal is a medical drug that only physicians can use.

That's pretty much it. Scott, like this, is an ongoing exploration; there's only very few of us that do this. And so there's probably not enough communication between the practitioners. What do you do when you see that? I recognize with our ART method when people take melatonin and have untoward reactions. It's usually they displace something from intracellular to extracellular, and that always means they're healthier than they were before, but it can be very uncomfortable.

[00:52:57.10] Scott: Bring us up to date on your current perspectives of the mold illness conversation. Can somebody recover their health if they're living in a home with mold, do you think that exposure to environmental mold in a water-damaged building can lead to internal colonization, let's say in the sinuses in the gut, for example? And what are some of the top interventions that you consider from a treatment perspective if someone is dealing with water damage building mold exposure?

[00:53:25.21] Dr. Klinghardt: Yes. So there's, of course, a three-day lecture. So first of all, let's square on this one here. So when you have mold in the house, there are two things that the mold does. One, it creates mycotoxins that is simply a defense molecule. These are poisonous things that the mold excretes, so it cannot be attacked by other things; that's one thing.

And then it creates mold spores; mold spores are similar to the cysts and Lyme disease. Mold spores contain the entire genome of the mold in them, and when you inhale that, so first of all, when you inhale the mycotoxin, we have a biotoxin pathway. And so we inhale it, it attaches to the system, but it can't hatch out anything alive. And so our own system processes that, and it kind of leaves through the liver typically into the gut and out and then what do we do? We look in the urine for it. Well, the urine is the place where it's really typically not; it should be in the poop because the biotoxin pathway largely goes through the liver.

Only a small portion goes through the kidneys. And so when you find mycotoxins in the pee like most of you are doing that test, it's really bad because there's only the overflow that the liver didn't manage, that's one issue. The other one is when you inhale spores, and they may or may not hatch out in you.

They're attached to the mucous membrane, and some of these mold spores, when I lived in New Mexico when the winds go over the desert, these spores haven't seen any water in 20,000 years, and now they're attaching to the mucous membrane. And that's the chance of that mold to become alive. And they're exploding into life, and the first thing that they do is produce mycotoxins to defend themselves against our immune system.

And so these are two very different things. I don't know where my former colleague or Ritchie Shoemaker stands on this right now. But he was a long time diminishing in his talks the possibility of the alive mold being in our system. For him, it was always alive mold was outside the body, and then the problem was mycotoxins.

But we see both, and when the mold is living in us, it is up to your immune system to be able to handle it or not. But mold is very intelligent, very versatile, very crafty, and the mold can arrange itself in peaceful ways with you, becomes part of your microbiome. All of us have some mold in our microbiome that actually may contribute to our health, right? So remember penicillin, you know penicillin is one of those biotoxins for mold.

And if you have mold in you, the penicillin species, they create other things, but they also create natural antibiotics that may, at times, be helpful to you. So we don't want to make the mold the entirely bad guy. What is bad is mold under the influence of microwave radiation, and we know that absolutely for sure has mutated, has activated backup genes that were asleep for the last 20,000 years. And mold in our homes when you add in the Wi-Fi has become lethal to our system.

The other factor that makes mold once this is mold outside our body. The mold inside our body, of course, gets also activated with the Wi-Fi. But the added factor in our system is the mercury. Mercury is a growth factor for mold in our system. And so for me, the step number one, number two in mold treatment is shut off the Wi-Fi. Without that, yes, you have to move, okay. So shut off the Wi-Fi is step number one, and step number two every mold treatment needs to be combined, with the search for and treatment of mercury and lead and some of the other toxic metals. So that is sort of really my main message.

And then the third one is once you shut off the Wi-Fi, and the mold is not deep in the wall, but they have a little bit of mold on the window sill or in the bathroom like most homes do. There's an Italian team that found that vaporizing propolis at a certain temperature. Propolis is the most negatively charged molecule in the world of biology. There's nothing else more negative. And so by vaporizing, you create this monomolecular vapor of propolis in the room, in the house.

And that 100% is such a high, the mold toxins are positively charged. They're globbed together, and they basically fall to the floor. And the home is basically biotoxin or mycotoxin free. The same applies to mold spores. They cannot survive in the presence of propolis. There are about 200 papers all in Italian, and so we got the instrument from them, and I was totally surprised that we can take very extremely mold sensitive people, you put the instrument in their home; it costs about a hundred bucks.

There's different, the Chinese unfortunately copied that and so you can buy these cartridges from China with propolis don't do that; it's full of crap. So you want to get the organic, clean propolis cartridges, of course, in there that lasts for about eight to ten days. It costs about two dollars for this time. And depending on the size of your house, you may need two or three of these instruments to clean up the home.

So yes, very often, that more damaged people that come to me are already at the end of their finances, and it's basically when you tell them you have to leave their home. It means basically moving into a tent somewhere. And right now, with the forest burning, and the environmental changes that we're going through and the Lyme disease waiting out there to be biting any camper. It may not be; the patient may move from hell to another kind of hell.

And so we try to make the home as livable as possible. Dr. Shoemaker is absolutely right, that once you've lived in a moldy home, the mycotoxins sticking on your clothes, they're in your breadbasket; they're all over the house. And so it may involve getting rid of a bunch of clothing and carpets and all that, but not necessarily getting rid of the home. The bathrooms, we always have them tear them up, and look at the drywall to see if there's more behind.

And so often yet the major source. And so yes, that needs to be done. But tearing down the home it may not be realistic in the life of the patient, so we use the propolis vaporizer that's KiScience makes it with the proper cartilages. And there's also propolis inhalation apparatus which has been absolutely a miracle for COVID-19 people that are in the ICU have a number of ICUs in England, Germany, and others followed my advice.

The first thing that patients get when they get the fever and then get the breath thing, they inhale propolis, and usually for five minutes in the inhalation, they no longer have any lung symptoms. But that's a whole other world.

[01:01:30.01] Scott: Many years ago, we became aware of PANDAS and that conditions association to strep and autoimmunity in children. Then we have the umbrella term PANS; with the current pandemic, we now have this similar condition called PIMS or pediatric inflammatory multisystem syndrome.

I’m curious from your perspective in PANS, what are the most common triggers that you see that kind of drive the condition? And what are some of the tools that maybe you use to help modulate the immune response while you're dealing with those underlying triggers?

[01:02:06.20] Dr. Klinghardt: Yes. So I mean you know that I use a lot of the German techniques like neural therapy. If it's an older child, we can inject the tonsils with procaine, but we can also do immune-modulatory techniques where we may do some procaine along the spine. There is a whole other technology that's not known here or hardly known, that I use that physicians and naturopaths can use, where we can get fantastic results. It's certainly grown beyond strep, Strep hemolyticus Group A.

That was the original culprit; the list has grown very long. And I should say that here, this is sort of honest, that using IgM was a phase that we went through that worked in some cases. But the radical new thing it's called helminth therapy, whereby the little sort of tiny vials it tastes like saltwater that have the eggs of certain worms in it, that's called Hymenolepis, is the name of the species.

And by swallowing that, the worm hatches out and then secretes immune-modulatory biotoxins that actually calm the immune system in the most normal way. This group of helminths or worms basically it has been in the human condition for millions of years. And should be there, and it's just not with us because of the environmental changes including the glyphosate kills that worm. And so you do that treatment every two to three weeks, and it's a fantastic tool that really instantly has superseded everything. We use homeopathy and the Sanum remedies and then, of course, treating Lyme disease, treating the infections, also finding viruses in there Herpes type 6. And we went through all that, and you were part of that.

Our group kind of looking and we also see that the tonsils that are largely in the focal point of this are downstream from the teeth, from the sinuses. And we find a lot of adult PANS and PANDAS in people that have infections up here, and they're kind of tend to settle there. And then you get this sudden onset of neuropsychiatric symptoms.

But I think the honest answer that I need to give you is all of the old methods are kind of out of the window since the helminth therapy has become available. Dr. O’Hara is I think the person that lectures at ILADS; DrOHara.com I think is her website, and then you can orient from there and take it from there. I think really, Scott, this is a revolution, and we had the pig whipworm. I think it was called for treating ulcerative colitis.

So the worm treatment has been around for a while. But the helminths, they're related to as mutualists, not parasites. The proper term they're mutualists. And I think most people don't know that. But the helminths, that the entirety of these worm-like things constitute the largest part of the microbiome of our planet. There are more of those in terms of their mass, the trees and ferns, and other things; it's a helminth.

And so they are a natural part of us, and so this is a wonderful therapy. And for me, I had to struggle with that because we see a lot of success in treating children with deworming agents. The one by the way that if some other things go south with that therapy is built for Biltricide knocks that out in one day so you can clean that back up if you made a mistake. But let's give them every two to three weeks for a couple of months and the results are so much better than anything else I’ve seen that I don't even mention the other things.

[01:06:45.10] Scott: Beautiful. Let's talk a little bit about hypermobility syndromes, Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome, CranioCervical Instability. These seem to be becoming more and more common. Some people suggest that glyphosate is playing a role in weakening our collagen and our structural integrity. Some people suggest that Bartonella is playing a role. Why do you think we're seeing more cases of EDS and CCI? And what are some of the ways that we can support our structural integrity, and potentially also help to treat these conditions?

[01:07:18.04] Dr. Klinghardt: So first of all, I’d like to say like a limiting thing. Sort of I treated my first case of Ehlers-Danlos with severe cervical instability 45 years ago. So I have to raise the suspicion that there may not be the sharp increase; there is a certainly a sharp increase in physicians having an eye on this. So I would be cautious with that, I’m absolutely not sure, because if it's sharply increasing, which it could be, then it will be linked to the same causes that we discussed.

The glyphosate, the electrosmog, the aluminum, so as a larger picture. So the cervical instability is largely between the occiput and C1, and little bit C1 to C2. This is where most the movement in the neck comes from. And so I’ve been working like an osteopath in the early part of my career. I actually lectured a lot of at a lot of osteopathic universities and had a lot of osteopathic friends.

And so I learned in England a set of tools it was a particular tractuib maneuver that I do pretty much on every patient at the right time that often gives people six months, eight months relief. It's a bit of a radical maneuver, but it's fantastic.

[01:08:49.18] Scott: I’ve seen it.

[01:08:52.14] Dr. Klinghardt: And then the other thing that I think most people are overlooking, the cervical instability, the spine is a self-adjusting organ that wants to be in the right place. That means that C1 and C2 have a tendency to be in the right place if they're given them the right conditions. So even if the ligaments are lax, they move in the right position.

But if there are forces on these two vertebrae that tweak them in a three-dimensional room in the wrong position, then internally that creates a kink in the brain stem that reaches in there and causes a variety of neurological symptoms. Now the forces that tweak C1 and C2 to sit in the wrong place almost entirely come from the dental occlusion. And so we had a whole university set up, Capital University in the 90s.

For seven years, I was a professor there where we lectured to dentists how to use our ART testing of how to figure out. You need two-hundredths of a millimeter increase on these teeth; more increase in the front than the back. To balance it and then boom, C1 moves in the right position, and C2 moves in the right position.

And the patient had amazing improvements; this is in the 90s. So for me, I’m smiling a little bit when people are coming on board now with the upper cervical instability, with all the new terms and all that. Because that's something that was part of my religion for a very long time. But getting back to the assumed causes of it, okay, what holds the vertebrae in place is the collagen. Collagen is an interesting molecule, but there's.

Also, we found the fascial research has found that that there are also contractile elements in there. So collagen is not just like a leather band, but it actually has, like a muscle has a few elements, and it can also contract it. And so in terms of the biochemistry of it, for the production of collagen, we need certain enzymes, and they're the same enzymes that I mentioned before that are often corrupted with glyphosate.

And so for the whole absorption of the base substance from the gut, the pancreas, enzymes, the proteinases and lipases, and the sugar split, the amylases, there's all cocktail of enzymes that is needed to absorb the base substance for what ultimately builds our ligaments and our muscle and our fascia. And if those enzymes are corrupted, you will be deficient in that. And I know you know Scott in the work some of our practitioners that you also know, they've gotten really big gung-ho on using collagen as a supplement.

I’m very worried about it because we found glyphosate in collagen. And so yes, there is the causes of it. And then in terms of treatment, so I balance the bite, unfortunately, all the dentists that really worked with me closely when I send somebody and say well, we need big whatever 0.1 millimeters on these two teeth back here. And over here, we need to kind of have 0.001 millimeter that the dentist thinks well, this Klinghardt is an insane person.

So there's no communication really possible between us and the dentist, which is a sad story. But the occlusion is important, the traction is important, and then the third one, of course, is the Prolotherapy. Prototherapy is an injection technique that tightens ligaments; it actually creates a stem cell infusion. So when you injure a ligament with a needle stick, it sends the signal out, and stem cells migrate to the area releasing their growth factors and their power into the area. And the ligaments are relaxed before they start tightening up and get more bulky.

That has been shown in the 1930s already, and so has been around since then. And of course, there is a whole subgroup of us in the US that do decent. Prototherapy is technically a bit more difficult to do that in the upper neck or let's put it this way. You have to be a bit more careful and know your anatomy a little bit better. But these are the big tools; one is to detox the gut for the food absorption and provide the right chemistry let's put it that way.

And I’m sure there are people listening to this that have other ideas of how to do that. But in terms of the actual structure, if you don't balance the bite, the thing will keep going out and keep going out and keep creating the kink. And the spinal cord, that will then create hundreds, if not more different symptoms. So the bite has to be first, and then the traction, and then the Prolotherapy and the treatment has been golden.

[01:14:08.01] Scott: Beautiful. I have a few of these areas here that I want to just kind of get your high-level thoughts on, and so the first one is the mitochondria. So I think we used to think that ATP was always a good thing.

I know you've talked about extracellular ATP and Bob Naviaux’s work around cell danger response. Is there a right time or a wrong time to start aggressively supporting the mitochondria and the production of ATP?

[01:14:34.18] Dr. Klinghardt: Yes, the right time to support the mitochondria is now. So the earlier, the better. We know that the mitochondria are an essential part of any healing of any illness; on any healing, the mitochondria are in there. It is taking a central role. The problem is that in the US, the teaching of how to heal the mitochondria always starts with the B vitamins and the carnitines.

And when you take all B vitamins, the first thing that you feed is the worms and the amoebas and the giardia and the things you don't want to feed. And so there have been problems with the therapy suggestions. The second one is all our mitochondria are highly toxic with aluminum. That there's an English outfit that can look into your mitochondria, and that's what the consistently find in the matter is Aluminum from the chemtrails, I'm not going to talk about that here, but we're all exposed. We're breathing it in; it ends up in the mitochondria and blocks the inner machinery.

And the most important, most frequently blocked step in the electron transfer on the mitochondria is a complex 1. And that is the one that needs NADH as a main healing tool. And so I'm a great friend of NADH, there is a product now it's become practical.

So we had like this product Enada, it was like five milligrams. I gave it to a thousand people, and a thousand times, I saw nothing. Then I met this guy Birkmayer in Germany; he says well, five milligrams that's okay, that's homeopathy that's fine. But it's probably not going to work. You need at least 50 milligrams three times a day. So I started doing that, and I started seeing some very nice improvements with people.

There's a product I’m not involved with this, but you can get it on Amazon, your doctor Amazon. That's the NADH from Dr. Birkmayer. It doesn't matter if you Google NADH, it's going to come up with one of the few choices. And it's called Rapid Energy, that's a natural NADH, it's sublingual absorption.

And you can easily get to 40, 50, 60 milligrams and explore at least, take one of the boxes and explore with the patient, how much do they need before they're feeling a lift and their energy and their chronic fatigue goes away. I’m not against all the other things that are done, and I know NAD can be given intravenously, that should be an eight-hour IV.

There is a lot of other things that you can do. But my big focus is on detoxing the aluminum, and I work almost inclusively with NADH. And then as we get the microbiome and the gut right and all the other things that we do, a lot of things fall back into line. But I personally believe that the rate-limiting step in the mitochondria is the production of NADH, where it needs help for a while. And the different enzymes are blocked through aluminum.

And of course, other environmental toxins as well. In my office, we have the intravenous laser therapy, which is absolutely fantastic. So we put laser light into the bloodstream, and you use photosensitizers. That means dyes basically are taken up by the mitochondria in the brain and the heart and so forth, and then when you put the light into the bloodstream; it activates the photosensitizers in the mitochondria. You get a huge boost of production of ATP. And really, the other things that the mitochondria are also doing, they create a lot of oxidative compounds that are needed for fighting infections and so on and so forth.

[01:18:35.08] Scott: Beautiful. I know you have been a proponent of Heparin when we come into the hypercoagulation discussion. And so that's one of the areas that I personally feel has been very commonly overlooked in chronic illness, in chronic Lyme disease.

It was something that I missed at various times throughout my own journey and was really surprised to see how hypercoagulated I was. And so how much of an issue is hypercoagulation in the chronic illness patients that you're working with, do you test for that commonly, and what are some of the top interventions from a coagulation perspective?

[01:19:09.10] Dr. Klinghardt: Yes. So we know that any toxicity leads to a hypercoagulability state. So any toxin that flows through your system thickens your blood and through a variety of mechanisms. But we also know that the Wi-Fi environment is huge in triggering the thickening of the blood, is when the body thinks it's been slashed by a sword and you're injured, and you need to stop bleeding.

But our system, the system in the blood on in the inner lining of the blood vessel, is not that smart. So any insult that it gets, it reacts, oh my god, I’m bleeding. Even though it's electrosmog or even though it's mercury floating through it and starts triggering the cascade of events that then thicken the blood. And there are, of course, many aspects of coagulation, but to keep it short like with COVID-19, I published in my KlinghardtInstitute.com is my website.

On Klinghardt Institute, I published my protocol for treating COVID-19 in January. And the treatment was a hydroxychloroquine; it was heparin, it was zinc, and the Zithromax, four things. And that has saved I know from the feedback thousands of lives by doing it. It's now published that this protocol actually would have saved 80% of lives if the government and the forces behind it wouldn't have suppressed that with a lot of fake news and fake studies.

But to keep it short, it's got many herbs are blood-thinning, even curcumin or Ginkgo biloba. And so I like to start there with my patients that I’m almost exclusively treat people with herbs or liposomal herbs. But the very next step is what type of blood thinning. And so, of course, heparin is naturally produced in our gut in our small intestine, and it's part of our connective tissue. Heparin has so many other wonderful healing effects. For example, it's a remedy against Babesia that's very little known; it works against the number of viruses.

So I recommend people because of the effort to have to draw up something and inject it and handle it cleanly, we use heparin. I use it when I’m flying anywhere; that's a must and a few days beyond. But when we, for example, give somebody a heavy metal chelation like DMPS or EDTA, it always goes together with at the same time; we give heparin to thin the blood and anticipated blood thickening response in the body.

I do not use aspirin; I prefer Ginkgo biloba to cover that aspect. But the miracle drug really is our enzymes, and I know there is a cascade from very effective to less effective. But also, unfortunately, from very expensive to less expensive, it's the lumbrokinase. It's really winning out on that, and then there's the Serrapeptase, and then comes Nattokinase and some of the other enzymes that we have available.

And I personally feel for more than just a coagulation reason that every patient needs to be on a blood-thinning protocol. We are not very good at testing the parameters; we had the time when we had the soluble fibrin monomers and had some really good parameters in the blood that we could test for, that all got shut down and eliminated.

We can test for fibrinogen that’s I think meaningful. But I don't have a concierge practice; I see real people; they're struggling with money. I know that everybody who goes through the treatment of Lyme disease or chronic infections or chronic fatigue needs to be on a blood-thinning strategy. And the easy endpoint is, can you go too high with that? Yes, you can.

The patient starts bruising; the gums start bleeding then we know okay, we have to back off a little bit. But with the strategies we use, we don't really have to be careful. The safe dose with heparin is 5,000 units, twice a day. That's from David Berg; he was one of the main guys. And at that level, we don't really need to monitor the PT/PTT and bleeding time, and all those things.

[01:23:55.00] Scott: Beautiful. I wanted to get an update on the state of the retrovirus conversation. So it's been several years now that you've been incorporating these retroviral silencing protocols. Curious how has that shifted your overall patient outcomes. Has it been as profound as you originally hoped?

What are some of the silencing strategies that are really your favorites at this time? And then how has that also shifted maybe the need for dental procedures like cavitations? We know that you identified the connection between retroviruses and cavitations and RANTES and all of that. And essentially, kind of started incorporating the retroviral strategies before jumping into some of the dental interventions. So what's the state of the union on the retroviral side?

[01:24:44.18] Dr. Klinghardt: Yes. So for me, it has been really big. Now I have to say that the strategies that we use, Judy Mikovis was my main mentor with that. And Julie has become now very famous for her political work in the background. And she wrote that book The Plague, and it was a really important book to read.

And so she was one of the early researchers in retroviruses, HIV being the most well-known one. And so she encouraged us to look, and people with chronic fatigue or chronic conditions that the retroviruses are always in the picture, and they certainly are. And so the main strategy that she has recommended was an extract of Skullcap called Baikalin that has incredible, powerful activity against the retroviruses.

Where we do not have to rely on the drugs that come from HIV like the protease inhibitors and all those. In my office, also the other practitioners that work with me, we have this strategy. When we treat our patients for a while, and we don't see progress, we put them on antiretroviral regime. And very often, that leads to the breakthrough.

It's just as simple as that. I use ART; I’m pretty good at it. And so we can pretty much predict in the beginning what the dominant bugs are. Is it a parasite picture, it's a mold picture, is with Lyme disease, is it retroviruses, it's the herpes viruses. So be very good and very early on determining that and put people in an appropriate regime.

But for the people listening on this, please check out Baikalin. I know BioPure has that; it's a miracle drug, also an anti-inflammatory of the brain. And an immune modulator does a thousand other things.

So what I want to say is like based on the successes with my retroviral treatment, I cannot for sure say that we really treated retroviruses. Because the CD26 and some of the other parameters that can be measured, Nagalase, it's got a bad rap years ago because a high level of nagalase is an indicator of retroviral activity. But we got letters from the medical board to not look there. It's better not to know, not to look.

Don't ask, don't tell, kind of policy. And so we don't use the medical test; there is a beautiful parameter, it's done in the rest of the words called RANTES, it for sure tells you the level of retroviral activity in the system. But it's not even available in the US. It costs like in Berlin in my hometown 28 Euros, which is about $25 to do this test, and so you get the answer right there. But if you ever sort of stuck on our own, you can do Nagalase; that's easy available.

If it's over 0.65, you got retroviral activity. And so we found that the cavitations and the jaw those of you who know cavitations, you know it? The bugs that are breeding in there, that's why it was always assumed that the hollow places in the jawbone, are abacteria; there's no infection in there.

Well, yes, there are no bacteria in there, but there are retroviruses, and they're breeding in there. And so when the cavitations are done, a lot of people get better, some people get worse, and some people get better for a while and flares back up again.

The symptoms related to that, and it turns out it's a retroviral activity. And so before we operate the jaw, I would put people on Baikalin and there's I designed a powder, it's called Retro V powder. That you can get, Sophia Nutrition, I think has it, but also Ki Science has it. That has all the known herbs in it that regulate and organize retroviral activity. So they're non-pathogenic, so it stops that.

And so yes, let's put it this way, like everything sort of that's new that we placed a huge amount of hope on, no it hasn't worked for everybody, hasn't changed everybody. But it's pretty much part of my protocol for every patient with chronic illness. And we've seen some amazing, with this one aspect, we've seen some amazing breakthroughs and a larger number of patients.

We also use Truvada. Truvada is the drug more well-known from the AIDS community. And that's quite an amazingly safe drug to use; sometimes we use that for a few months to get maybe a little extra punch with it. And yes, we certainly have rescued a number of people.

[01:29:51.29] Thanks for listening to episode 127, Klinghardt Conversations 3. Our conversation was so much fun, and time simply got away from us. You'll find the rest of this discussion in episode 128, Klinghardt Conversations 4.

[01:30:09.19] To learn more about today's guest, visit KlinghardtInstitute.com or SophiaHI.com. KlinghardtInstitute.com or SophiaHI.com. KlinghardtInstitute.com or SophiaHI.com.

[01:30:30.01] Thanks for listening to today's episode. If you're enjoying the show, please leave a positive rating or review, as doing so will help the show reach a broader audience. To follow me on Facebook, Instagram, or Twitter, you can find me there as better health guy. If you'd like to support the show, please visit BetterHealthGuy.com/donate. And to be added to my newsletter, visit BetterHealthGuy.com/newsletters. This and other shows can be found on YouTube, iTunes, Google Play, Stitcher, and Spotify.

[01:31:05.08] Thanks for listening to this BetterHealthGuy Blogcast, with Scott, your Better Health Guy. To check out additional shows and learn more about Scott's personal journey to better health, please visit BetterHealthGuy.com.

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  BetterHealthGuy.com is intended to share my personal experience in recovering from my own chronic illness.  Information presented is based on my journey working with my doctors and other practitioners as well as things I have learned from conferences and other helpful resources.  As always, any medical decisions should be made only with the guidance of your own personal medical authority.  Everyone is unique and what may be right for me may not be right for others.